THE MUPPET CHRISTMAS CAROL

 

00:19.64
mikechumpchange
All right? 3 2 1 hit record. Hello everyone and welcome to the pod and the pendulum and if you are listening to this on the day the episode drops then there's either 1 more sleep or no more sleeps until Christmas it is. Time for our annual deep dive into a non horror holiday favorite this year we are taking a look back at what might be the greatest adaptation of Charles Dickens classic with 1992 s a Muppet Christmas Carol always I'm not alone this week I am visited by two Christmas spirits we need a third I guess I'm the third stepping back in the co-host chair the bunsen to my beaker the statler to my Waldorf the rizzo to my gonzo the great I think you get the point. Mr. Stephen Foxworthy how are we this morning.

01:19.89
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Mike hi ho I am thrilled that to be talking muppets I am thrilled to be talking this movie I am thrilled to be snuggled in my warm place and that we are just you know, spreading the news about peace and keeping love alive.

01:35.75
mikechumpchange
When did we decide on this one.

01:40.18
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I feel like I think you already had it's a wonderful life in the hopper for last year but I think last year we were talking on the Patreon um streaming service roundtable discussion I brought up my mupp. My love for muppets when I recommended Muppet haunted him mansion.

01:53.13
mikechumpchange
Um, so.

01:57.27
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And you're like we need to talk Muppets sometime and I think that was the germ from which this all expanded pretty much. Yeah.

02:00.38
mikechumpchange
Okay, so it's been a year that we've been waiting to talk about this movie and now we finally get you so ah, there will be absolutely no letdown whatsoever like no anticipation and hell let down whatsoever. Awesome. But also joining us. We have a first -time guest to the show rachel is a photographer and artist hailing from indianapolis she special she specializes in shabari rope bondage and nude portraits with an emphasis on body. Positivity. Let's welcome rachel to the show. How are we this morning.

02:34.93
Rachel
I am amazing I have been waiting literally my entire life to talk about Muffet Christmas Carol so I am grateful for a platform where y'all left listen to me.

02:43.70
mikechumpchange
Excellent. Yeah, we just kind of threw it out there like does anybody want to talk a muppets Christmas Carol with us because I like hearing from random people just like the people that aren't I like having guests on the show. It makes it fun.

02:50.55
Rachel
Me always.

02:59.70
mikechumpchange
And you're like I can talk about this movie for hours I'm like all right, we're gonna try you on that we're gonna literally put that to the test so challenge accepted. Do it. Okay, let's go act 1

03:03.38
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Challenge accepted.

03:04.99
Rachel
I can probably act it all out for you right now on this video screen I love this movie just a season 2 be jo oh kind I start beginning.

03:09.20
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Go.

03:16.53
mikechumpchange
Ah, there was a point like this morning like it was pretty early when I messaged you and I'm like hey just have like headphones and a mic and you're like oh I don't have a mic and I thought for a second like so every computer has a mic and it was still early and I'm like. She think we're doing interpretive dance. It's a podcast like how is she going to join us for the show and I got it? No no, we would not ask anyone to do that. We would not ask anyone to do that. Um.

03:38.99
Rachel
I felt I needed what you needed like a professional thing I was like I can run to Walmart like I don't want to do it on the twenty third but

03:47.91
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Now.

03:51.71
mikechumpchange
But no, we after the coffee kicked in I figured out what you meant. So I think we're okay.

03:55.11
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, but.

03:57.10
Rachel
Um I am the least tech savvy person probably in the world. So well yeah feel.

04:01.86
mikechumpchange
Ah, we've had some guests that would challenge you on that or we've had some otherss that would definitely challenge that. Um, that's ok so before we dive into the movie proper and the background of the movie. Let's kind of. Go with our initial thoughts and it's kind of got a 2 for here and I guess before we talk about the muppets proper. What was everyone's introduction to Charles Dickens or Christmas Carol and Rachel as our guest would you mind talking about like when you might have first. Read or heard of dickens a Christmas Carol oh wow. Okay.

04:37.70
Rachel
Honestly, the first time was this movie I saw it I saw it in theaters I was 6 I was super super excited for that I think I honestly don't remember it but my sister and dad tell me we were there and I loved it every second of it. But um.

04:51.21
mikechumpchange
Um.

04:53.48
Rachel
So that was my first this was what I thought Charles dicks Christmas Carol was I was like oh obviously it's muppets. So yeah I like this is the story I don't know why they don't have Rizzo in the original. But yeah, true. Yes.

04:58.32
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Obviously.

05:00.72
mikechumpchange
Um, obviously so when you would watch other versions where you're like wait a minute where's fosy wake This is horseit.

05:11.82
Rachel
Exactly I'm like I don't like this bring back bring back the bear ah truly in all the other versions were like we just if you just put a bear in it. It would be good. So yeah, that was my first never read the book I don't really care for dickens.

05:13.19
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I Mean that's everybody's complaint honestly.

05:17.35
mikechumpchange
Has.

05:25.92
mikechumpchange
Um, okay, and Stephen how about yourself.

05:31.83
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I guess my first exposure to the story was probably Mickey's Christmas Carol which I used to watch as a kid on just I mean anytime the Christmas specials made their rounds on Tv it was appointment viewing like my family would kind of stop what we were doing and watch those.

05:38.96
mikechumpchange
Vu.

05:50.58
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, so and if we couldn't watch them. We'd record them off Tv so eventually we had them all on vhs tapes. Um, but that was probably my first exposure to the story. But I read the book in fifth grade in school and then afterwards we watched this movie on Vhs so this that was my first exposure to this movie. Um, and i've.

06:08.98
mikechumpchange
Um.

06:09.87
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Pretty much loved it ever since. So yeah.

06:11.71
mikechumpchange
Excellent. So for us like my dad used to read us this story every Christmas season and I guess that's a tradition I guess like that was not an uncommon thing where. Ah, he would break it in chunks like chapter by chapter and he would time it so that he would wrap up like we would be the house that through the Christmas Eve family party every year and then we would go out to either nana's or Grandma's or Christmas day but we had like. His side of the family and my mom's side would get together at our place every Christmas eve he would time it to wrap up like right before all the guests would arrive and like the week before Christmas he would just like sit us by the fire and he would read to us this honestly carried on till i. Think I was in high school because I had a younger sister as well. So it's kind of a nice kind of family tradition in dad. Yeah dad would always cry when he would get to the ghost of christmas yet to come in tiny tim's death like that would always make him tear up.

07:04.67
Rachel
I Love that.

07:07.68
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
That's awesome.

07:16.75
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

07:19.52
mikechumpchange
You know my dad passed when I was 19 and I like to joke that like I'll never forget his like final words to me or like it should be you son? Ah but like that was were not his final words which that would be amazing.

07:31.20
Rachel
Um.

07:34.59
Rachel
Um.

07:35.58
mikechumpchange
That would be awesome, but no, it's just like a really great memory and I just remember growing up like we would go see this not just like watch like the George C Scott version was the one we would watch on television which is awesome like it's probably like my second favorite.

07:36.00
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, the story for sure.

07:48.91
Rachel
Yep, yes, agreed so good.

07:51.90
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right.

07:53.27
mikechumpchange
Version of this like that one is like George C Scott who I don't think is acting because I think he's just that crumudgeonly I think that's just him like no acting I think the George C Scott version he's like do I really have to like be nice at the end. Why can't it just be I wake up and I'm like oh that was a shitty dream and then I just go for.

07:57.55
Rachel
A.

08:06.17
Rachel
Fuck you I'm keeping my money. Well.

08:10.60
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Just slightly less cranky Maybe and right.

08:12.21
mikechumpchange
Yeah I just go foreclosed. Yeah I just go foreclosing some houses at the end. It's like no George that's not the point but we would go to like North and north shore like theater would do this state as a stage play every year and we would go and catch that like our school would go on school so field trips.

08:29.40
Rachel
Oh.

08:31.71
mikechumpchange
Um, I think as like recently is 2019 my wife and I went to catch this as ah, the ah production for like live theater like I just love this story. So ah, it's you know it's been in our family forever. So and how about the muppets themselves like I feel like.

08:43.34
Rachel
Yeah, yeah.

08:50.53
mikechumpchange
They don't have the same sort of cultural cachet they did when we were growing up when they were kind of ubiquitous and everywhere. But what was all you like your early experiences with the muppets and what do they mean to you as kids because I feel like in the 80 s and 90 s like.

08:57.87
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And.

09:09.39
mikechumpchange
Everyone knew and loved the muppets and now people look at you funny when you mention them to a certain degree.

09:15.45
Rachel
Well I actually I come from a like strangely media averse family like my parents don't still don't really consume media. So as a kid like we didn't have.

09:19.98
mikechumpchange
Okay.

09:27.61
Rachel
A lot in our lives so like my muppet until the internet and I got a little bit older like my muppet exposure was very low I saw this movie so I was like this is the muppets and I'm obsessed a little bit of sesame street little bit of Muppet babies. But I didn't know a ton about the muppets until I got older and started being obsessed with Jim Henson as an artist.

09:34.91
mikechumpchange
V.

09:46.90
Rachel
And a puppeteer and all the crazy wacky shit he does um so I didn't have a lot about it. But this was it and I was obviously obsessed. Um, yep.

09:56.98
mikechumpchange
So could I ask you? then because you're a photographer and you do like a lot of live shoots and like a lot of your shoots are fairly complicated because you're doing like a lot of like rope photography and there's like a lot of moving parts to that. Um. How would you because you I just heard you mention like hence Henson there. How would you say like his like puppetry or his like work like influenced or yeah I guess influence like kind of like sticks to what you do or like influences what you do now.

10:26.22
Rachel
I Think just seeing an artist who is so completely committed to their vision. It's not. It's completely different from what mine is but someone who's like hey listen I'm going to create these wild puppets or even he did this experimental video about time in his early career that was really like stop motion and wild.

10:32.16
mikechumpchange
Blue.

10:41.24
mikechumpchange
Move.

10:45.23
Rachel
So like those kind of things where it's like it isn't what everyone was doing. It isn't necessarily the most desirable at times it's like I have this thing in my mind and I'm gonna make it and the way I do that is with puppets I feel like that's how I see my art I want to show something and I use photo or rope or people to do so So it's just.

10:59.00
mikechumpchange
Vu. Ok.

11:04.66
Rachel
Kind of inspired me in that way to just like say fuck it and be like I want to do this thing I want to make a giant six foot bird and you're like yeah, do it.

11:09.45
mikechumpchange
Excellent, okay and Stephen how about yourself.

11:13.73
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Oh I'm I am an avid avid henson fan from birth pretty much like I I watched sesame street growing up. My mom says that I used to do try to do all the voices for all the characters I had little imitations for every character based on their catchphrases. As like as soon as I learned to talk I was quoting sesame street um Muppet babies went on to that I think Muppet babies was my first exposure to star wars weirdly and Indiana Jones like I think I'd learned what those were from muppet babies. Um, and then of course reruns of the muppet show and then. Being able to like rent and watch the movies when they came on tv so I I literally grew up with the muppets like when we went to Disney world when I was a kid I I had to go to mgm so I could see muppet vision 3 d like I and I think I said on that Patreon episode that we did I think overall muppets are my favorite franchise.

12:09.00
Rachel
Um, yes.

12:10.20
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Are not like I love the muppets they are. They are my comfort watch I am just hurt by the fact that Disney has not seen the value of the property that they have at their disposal with the muppets because they could be making all the money.

12:10.17
mikechumpchange
Um.

12:26.23
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, if they just knew how to utilize them properly but it just kind of feels like they don't know what they're doing and they don't want to listen to. They don't they don't and they don't want to listen to the people that do um, which is why Steve Whitmeier is no longer with the with the Henson Corporation unfortunately um and I mean I've got.

12:31.51
mikechumpchange
Um, they don't know what to do with them.

12:38.13
mikechumpchange
Who yeah.

12:45.25
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Muppet thoughts I've got I'm I'm coming to this table locked and loaded with Muppet thoughts today Mike so.

12:48.77
Rachel
In in.

12:50.90
mikechumpchange
Um, well give us your big muppet thought like if you were going to relaunch the muppets today in 2024 you're going to make that the year of the muppets like what would be the first thing you would do.

13:01.27
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Well I think the 2 most recent decent things that happened with the muppets were ah the twenty eleven film and Muppet haunted haunted mansion and I think those 2 things demonstrate what the muppets do best which is the let's put on a show mentality.

13:08.73
mikechumpchange
Move.

13:09.70
Rachel
The haunted man fell.

13:18.49
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
That was such that was so pivotal to the original muppe show and what made it work. It's this scrappy group of artists who don't who really don't go together at all but they' are a team. They're a troop and anyone who's ever been a part of an acting troop or ah, an artistic group. Knows like those ins and outs and knows those artistic struggles and knows why a role like Kermit is so both so thankless and so important. Um, but then also the idea that I think Henson started when he started making them up at movies. Is that these aren't so much the muppets doing these things but these are the muppets themselves as performers performing this piece and I think that's what this movie does really well and I think that's what Muppet haunted mansion does really well and I think there are lots of different things that Disney could be doing with the muppets utilizing.

13:53.89
mikechumpchange
Remove.

14:07.64
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Both of those ideas muppets now I think is the closest we came but that still seemed kind of it fell kind of flat because there was very little interaction. It was all like we're all in covid talking to our Zoom screens kind of like we are now. Um, but it lacked the kind of dynamism that you would get from. The backstage antics at the muppet theater right? So um, yeah I mean basically distilling it down to first principles figuring out why it works what works about it I think so many times they're trying to filter them upets through different lenses like um. Like filtering them up through the office lens on that old Abc show the muppets that just didn't really work. Um, that's not what the muppets is. It's not what it was designed to be there. The there's no inner politics between the muppets. They just are who they are. They're kind of beings of pure id um putting on a show for our amusement and enjoyment.

14:43.85
mikechumpchange
Vote.

14:46.25
Rachel
Um, and.

14:48.51
mikechumpchange
But right.

14:53.99
mikechumpchange
Right.

15:01.36
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And that's and then the the special guests are there more to facilitate the wackiness than they are to um you know be to you know promote things or what have you? So I don't know that's that's my thought for what it's worth.

15:13.18
mikechumpchange
I I enjoyed the twenty Eleven movie but I think that the issue I have with it is that like Siegel's script kind of reeked of desperation a little bit like he was kind of like.

15:23.90
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
It did.

15:27.33
mikechumpchange
Desperate to make the Muppets relevant like every other sentence was like you're important where I thought like Muppets most wanted was more just the Muppets having a caper and that was kind of like really fun about it. It's just like the muppets are going to get into Shenanigans and I think that is when the Rat through pest.

15:42.40
Rachel
Agreed I Love Muppets most wanted. It gives me great Muppet caper vibes that just unhinged group comedy.

15:46.40
mikechumpchange
Yeah, yeah.

15:46.47
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, and.

15:51.66
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And I think that's the thing ah that kind of knocks it for me is that it feels like it's trying too hard to be muppe. Great Muppet caper for me I need to revisit it I've not seen it in a few years so I need to go back and give it another shake which honestly at some point I'm going to sit down and rewatch all the Muppet films. So.

15:56.63
Rachel
Um, yeah, so.

15:56.66
mikechumpchange
For whom.

16:03.75
mikechumpchange
Well let's let's let's pause the show for a little bit. Go ahead and do that come back and then we'll do that. Ah, Rachel's face right now sick he's we're really going to do that. Um.

16:05.10
Rachel
Um, yeah.

16:08.93
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Ah, all right? Let me me cue it up here.

16:19.60
Rachel
Um, I'm like no let's do it.

16:19.62
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

16:21.14
mikechumpchange
I know Stephen I kind of a similar experience. See you like I grew up on like the muppet show like every Sunday night on Abc ah like watching that show like I have like distinct memories of like especially the star wars one with like Mark Hamel and like pigs in space and like mupp after theater and like.

16:33.79
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, hell yeah.

16:39.56
mikechumpchange
Ah, the boomerang fish and just like the swedish chef and herigger degery like super early memory and of course like sesame street like growing up like I had a grover stuffed animal until sixth grade and I think my parents quietly removed it.

16:41.46
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yes.

16:57.92
mikechumpchange
Because they're like I would take it with me like on sleepovers and my parents are following like okay enough is enough like you probably not have this anymore. This is why you're bullied. Um, so I like you know pre Amazon days like pre-internet days when.

17:01.81
Rachel
Oh.

17:02.26
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Brave.

17:16.44
mikechumpchange
You could order anything you want and get it in a day I used to like scour um because my favorite Muppet is Fozzy bear I would scour like flea markets for like a fozzy bear stuffed animal and like a then girlfriend one day surprised me with I still own it. Um, like a fozzy bear stuffed animal I've had it since 94 95 at this point like 30 years um it's yeah, it's a full on you know it could have bears of its own. It was like just a cool gift when I published a punk scene.

17:37.98
Rachel
Damn it is a full adult now.

17:39.28
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Ah, oh that's awesome. You.

17:53.19
mikechumpchange
Way back in the day every band I interviewed like the last question would be if you could take any muppet on a date in order we like and the muppets are gender neutral like you can doesn't you know we're like we we just we with ro even in the 90 s we're like which we never even thought of that shit back then we're like.

18:00.31
Rachel
Oh yeah.

18:11.28
mikechumpchange
You know if you want to date kmit. Whatever like there's no gender to the muppets. You can two k whereverever you want to if you want to date any Muppet who would it be and where would you go and I remember like Ian Mackay of Fugazi trying to claim me and never heard of the muppets and me arguing so never meet your heroes because I remember getting in an argument with him.

18:25.68
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah.

18:27.50
Rachel
Um, yeah.

18:29.98
mikechumpchange
Like about how have you never heard of the muppets and him just being like I've never heard of the muppets I'm like I don't believe you like just answer the question like why won't you answer this question I'm like I promise yeah and he's like I don't know what the muppets are I'm like Kermit the frog. He's like I don't know what that is.

18:39.30
Rachel
The simple question.

18:46.30
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Dead.

18:48.80
mikechumpchange
I'm like I don't believe you've never heard of crimer the frog in like 1995 like you're a liar so all would be fozz and be fozzy I'd be totally fuzzy bear.

18:51.10
Rachel
Truly so what is the Muppet you would go on a date with and where okay yeah, yeah.

18:51.23
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Wow.

18:57.83
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, good question. Good call good call.

19:02.23
mikechumpchange
We wouldn't go to a comedy club because I think that would be embarrassing for him to see really good just you know would be shameful but bowling I could see him being a good bowler. You know there's nice shoes. So definitely be fozzy bear So Wao walk. So I Just yeah I adore the muppets. Um.

19:09.78
Rachel
Um, you know yeah for.

19:12.73
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, right on.

19:19.76
mikechumpchange
Got to watch the muppt movie again over break. It's one of my favorites and yeah, all right? Let's talk a little bit about this movie's background at how it came together I'm going to try to fly through some of this here. Ah first like. Super quick background on just Charles Dickens a Christmas carol before we talk about this movie specifically the Novello is first published in December of eighteen forty three and it was during a time when Dickens was experiencing financial hardships of his own. Ah, it revived his fortunes a bit but when he wrote it he meant it to be a direct critique of capitalism dickens himself was born into a middle-class family. His father was a bit of a layabout and was thrown in debtors prison when Charles was 12 so the future author had to leave school and begin work in a rat-infested factory which kind of helped in order to help support his mother and his siblings so that go on to influence a lot of his writing later on.

20:23.80
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

20:27.35
mikechumpchange
Rachel you mentioned you're not a huge fan of dickens his just his work or the man or.

20:33.61
Rachel
It's his work I think if you took almost every book he wrote which maybe I should read Christmas carol cause it's short but like great expectations I would say 20% of that book is amazing and then like 80% is him spending 20 pages describing a like wall or a flowing river and I'm just like get.

20:37.21
mikechumpchange
Um, move.

20:47.50
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah, know it's like George R R Martin describing food in the grim of thrones books things like money.

20:50.72
Rachel
Get to the fucking point like let but let's get there. So yes, yeah I like I got it I got it creating it.

20:57.82
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
It's he's building atmosphere. He's painting a picture. He's he's trying to get the entire scheme in your mind.

21:03.19
mikechumpchange
Yeah, yeah, yeah, a Christmas Carol's short I mean it's a novella you can get through it in a couple hours top so it's know um in 43 early in the year I think February Dickens towardured the cornish tin mines.

21:07.60
Rachel
Maybe I'll read it over this break.

21:08.70
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah, there you go.

21:20.60
mikechumpchange
Ah, which is where my wife's father used to work not in 1843 and but um bump but where he was like disgusted defying children working and I can't believe I but up bumped and then said also elder and interests also child labor.

21:32.83
Rachel
Child labor 2

21:38.78
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

21:39.19
mikechumpchange
Um, but we'll leave that in so he tours the 10 minds and he's disgusted defying children working in dangerous and disgusting conditions by October of that year sickened by what he had seen during the tour as well as reading the parliamentary report that had been published in february.

21:48.77
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
You know.

21:58.70
mikechumpchange
Ah, titled the second report of the children's employment commission on the effects of the industrial revolution on the working class children dickens was out giving public lectures imploring the working class to unite together to lobby for educational and labor reform. So he's basically. Calling for unions in the 1840 s and he's giving these lectures that he decides like this isn't really working like just going out and giving these stump speeches is it enough. He's a writer and he writes fiction. He's like I can change hearts and minds by my. Art and he feels like he can have a much more of a influence on on the populace by writing a widely distributed Christmas parable rather than delivering lectures and he had written about Christmas before he had already published like 4 short like secular stories in the past like throughout the 1830 s ah so the novella is published like in December of eighteen forty three so he turns it around pretty quickly and it's an instant hit so much so that like his other publishers are plagiarizing it. Ah, that they're withholding his ah commissions on it and he has to actually sue them in order to get like paid his proper wage and like what he's owed for it out is pretty amazing by 1840. That's never been out of print since its first publication.

23:32.43
mikechumpchange
By Eighteen Forty nine like dickensisdoingpublicreadingsofthestorywhichhewouldcontinuetodountiltheyear of his death in 1870 and it remains what are the most adapted stories for stage for film television and radio of all time. Like there's about 119 adaptations of it between all different mediums I think 53 of them on film like it's yeah, it's one of those things that like there's always something in the works going on for it. So maybe we mentioned the George C Scott one there is the Patrick Stewart version

23:54.44
Rachel
Damn.

24:10.33
mikechumpchange
There's obviously scrooged with Bill Murray and there's just like tons of these that have like been made and adapted I just happen to think that this is one of the best and like 1 of the most faithful versions of it so and it did have like a pretty far-reaching influence like not only. In terms like persons talking about like the anti-capitalism critique and helping out like the working poor but also just in terms of the phrase merry Christmas although it had been used prior to the publication of it. It became like a lot more widespread. Um, the idea of like gathering like families gathering in homes like because of the depiction and here like that became more and more popular as well because this is published at a time where you have not just like your traditional Christmas caroling. But. For the first time like putting Christmas trees at home and sending out Christmas cards like that is just becoming a thing in Victorian England and it's depicted here at the novella and because this is such a widespread and widely distributed story like those traditions are picked up in England and elsewhere as well. So it's. Influence is not just in terms of like it the thematic work but also like the cultural impact of it as well carries over so Charles Dickens there you? what I mean who knew.

25:32.16
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
What a guy.

25:33.43
Rachel
Who knew.

25:38.27
mikechumpchange
So the muppets themselves know strangers to Christmas specials prior to this movie 1977 gives us 1 of the most melancholy holiday programs of all time with Emmett Otters jugband Christmas and I've got to ask both of you. You have both seen this I imagine correct and what are your thoughts quickly on this particular.

26:00.45
Rachel
It's so good.

26:01.45
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I I have tragically not yet seen um Emmet Otters junk band Christmas it's it's on my list. Maybe this is the year. Maybe that's what I do after we're done recording after I'm done watching muppets most wanted I put on a menath's junk Pan Christmas

26:12.44
mikechumpchange
Rachel your thoughts.

26:16.49
Rachel
It's so good. It's so sad and it's just like it's just a completely different vibe of any of their other christmas ones. So like I don't watch it every year, but sometimes you gotta get your Christmas cries so you got to watch it.

26:22.59
mikechumpchange
Um, now.

26:26.00
mikechumpchange
Yeah, it I mean it ends on a downer note It's one of those things where I mean it's yeah and there are no muppets in it. It's like that their Muppet creations puppet creations but definitely not upppets.

26:30.42
Rachel
And.

26:36.49
Rachel
Exactly in.

26:40.34
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And.

26:42.86
mikechumpchange
Um, the music is wonderful and it's really beautiful and really well done. But yeah, you'll definitely get your Christmas cries and I have only watched it a couple times because it's so heartbreaking.

26:53.61
Rachel
Same I feel like I listen to a song or 2 sometime you know like you go on. You're like okay I'll listen to this one but it's no Muppet family Christmas that's for sure.

27:02.69
mikechumpchange
No no and there is ah the 1979 like coming off the success of the muppet movie a couple years later in 1979 the muppets are paired with John Denver and they do television special special. Ah, Christmas together. They also release a Christmas album for that special which is really good and then you're right in 1987 just a few years before this movie there is a Muppet family Christmas which I have never seen so what is.

27:33.48
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, it's on Youtube Mike it is on Youtube go watch it. Oh Mike yes, yes, they all the entire muppet collect clan piles into Fozzy's pickup truck.

27:35.92
mikechumpchange
What is a Muppet family Christmas I've is that when they go visit Fozzy Bear's mom is that the one. Okay.

27:39.81
Rachel
Yes, yes, yes.

27:47.54
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And they all drive to to surprise his mother who's gotten tickets to I think Malibu yeah to California I watched this like just the other day after I finished my watch of this movie I put I'm up with family cresbus because I'm like I need I need that nostalgia hit um and they.

27:52.89
Rachel
Malibu I think yeah.

27:55.22
mikechumpchange
Um.

27:58.19
mikechumpchange
Okay.

28:00.20
Rachel
Same.

28:04.60
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Ah, she's rented her place out to dock and sprock it from fraggle rock. But once the gang shows up. She's just like well okay sure everybody in and then the sesame street gang shows up to do some caroling. Um and then Kermit's nephew Robin goes down in the basement and finds a fraggle hole. And so he and kermit go in and they meet fraggels. Um, and they talk about the different Christmas traditions that fraggels have um and then at the like the entire last maybe 5 minutes 5 to 6 minutes of the the special is just every character from all these shows singing Christmas carols together. And it is. It's great. It's amazing and then Jim Henson himself shows up at the end to wash dishes with sprocket. it's it's it's a it's a delight it and it is just like pure nostalgia hook to my veins I used to watch this as a kid.

28:47.27
mikechumpchange
Um, this sounds wonderful.

28:50.48
Rachel
It's amazing. Truly.

28:57.83
mikechumpchange
Um I have never done mushrooms and I kind of want to and I kind of want to do it and watch this this special while doing mushrooms. Okay, that.

29:06.56
Rachel
Yes, hundred percent yes ah yeah.

29:08.92
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Ah, ah, be a good that that would be a good time. You probably have a good trip.

29:12.81
mikechumpchange
That sounds like an absolutely amazing time. But I think it's on Youtube's what you're saying okay, okay so I think I will like queue that up and I you know I've watched this 3 times already this season partly to prepare.

29:15.57
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
It is the entire it is and Youtube and it's on Youtube in its entirety.

29:26.76
Rachel
Yes.

29:29.80
mikechumpchange
For this show and I mentioned to my daughter like we're recording on this. He's like well that movie's amazing I haven't watched it this season yet I'm like all right? Well I guess we'll queue it up for the fourth time tonight after dinner and do a little you know, popcorn and hot cocoa and it'll be our ah you know like Christmas little Christmas movie for the night

29:38.10
Rachel
Yes, yes.

29:40.96
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yep.

29:47.21
Rachel
Yeah, love that.

29:48.98
mikechumpchange
So I can watch this so many times you know it's it's so it's 85 minutes so you know not a huge, not a huge commitment all right, all perfect. Okay, perfect.

29:49.17
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Hell yeah, um.

29:55.12
Rachel
Um, yeah I think Muppet family Christmas is like 45 maybe if you so I'm like you can throw it on before get little double feature going true. Yes.

29:55.72
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Not at all. Yeah, absolutely that would make a part it think is someone who just did the double feature. It's a great double feature.

30:08.10
mikechumpchange
Perfect. We'll do that so in Ninety Ninety Jim Henson passes away his son Brian takes over is like the creative director and Ceo of the muppets and Brian does not want to draw. Any direct comparisons to himself or his dad. So the idea of like adapting a literary property as opposed to doing another original film in the style of like muppets take Manhattan or great muppet caper like it's much more appealing to him because they can just adapt something. So he's much more on board.

30:47.25
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
There's some precedent there too. Ah because there had been I think like maybe like a henson story book classic or something where they had adapted different stories with Muppet characters some with actual Muppet characters and some just with henson creations.

30:56.48
mikechumpchange
Leave fast.

31:03.50
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
So there's there's definitely some precedent there um leading into it. But in addition to henson dying Richard Hunt 1 of the original muppet performers. He passes away earlier in 92 he's the man behind scooter janice beer Sweden's many many other he was one of the original voices of miss piggy.

31:03.13
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah.

31:18.46
mikechumpchange
Blue.

31:22.57
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, before frank oz fully took that rollover he passes away in 92 due to complications from aids and this film is dedicated both to Jim and to Richard Hunt um but yeah, they're both incredible and their absences is definitely felt in this movie I think.

31:27.12
mikechumpchange
1 l.

31:37.21
mikechumpchange
Now yeah, because you do see like there are a number of muppets missing and we'll talk about that and we kind of talk about the movie. Um, you're right because there there is the storyteller which I think ran on Nbc um.

31:46.85
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, the.

31:50.80
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
With John hurt.

31:54.27
mikechumpchange
Yeah, and it's like adapting like fairy taleles and literary tales like they would do a different one and that's where like Brian Henson got like so some of his beginning and we'll talk about that here in a moment and's a little bit darker material as well. It's not necessarily like. You wouldn't expect to see Kermit like pop up on something like that.

32:13.49
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And that was something that Henson was really passionate about the the further he got into his career I was reading something on Steve Whitmeier's blog earlier. Um and he's writing about you know Henson would never go back and watch the old stuff. He was always wanted to kind of push forward and I I think particularly when you see stuff like the dark crystal and labyrinth he was really passionate about.

32:27.28
mikechumpchange
Um.

32:32.60
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Getting like making puppet forward things for adults and I think the storyteller was just a step in that journey for him.

32:34.46
mikechumpchange
Whose.

32:40.26
mikechumpchange
Yeah, yeah, in a lot of ways like the things like the muppets and sesame street like that pays the bills. You know what? I mean like the the licensing from like the muppets alone allows like Jim Henson to do labyrinth and dark crystal which maybe aren't.

32:46.49
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah.

32:56.99
mikechumpchange
Commercially, you successful but are like a lot more groundbreak. Well they're groundbreaking and pioneering and maybe more to his like aesthetic at that point. So um, originally this is going to be a made for Tv movie.

33:04.50
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right.

33:13.79
mikechumpchange
It's actually not going to be a theatrical release like it's going to be on Abc and be like the Sunday night movie of the week something family would gather around back when that would be a huge deal like back when not everybody has cable and you're going to get like 30000000 probably in all honesty more people.

33:19.65
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

33:31.82
mikechumpchange
Probably would have watched this on television than wound up seeing it in movie theaters during its original theatrical run. Ah, but after Jerry Juul turns in his script like Disney loves the script and decides like why don't we release this and distribute the film theatrically. They feel like they have the potential for a massive holiday hit on their hands.

33:54.21
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right? I mean Jerry Juul is just one of the one of the names that you hear alongside Henson as just like 1 of the pioneers of the early muppet stuff and most of the great stuff that they put out in those early days has.

34:10.23
mikechumpchange
Who.

34:10.96
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Jerry Jules ' name on it like his. He's his is the script that they use for the original Muppet movie. Um, he's with the writer on like muppet treasure island he's the head writer on the muppet show like he is after Henson I would say he's probably the guy the kind of best. Hones the aesthetic and the sense of humor of the muppets I think Henson and jewel kind of share that responsibility so anything Jerry Jewel is going to turn. It's going to be amazing.

34:36.19
mikechumpchange
I I would say the third guy is Paul Williams so we'll talk about in a little bit like that would be like the 3 people. Ah well Frank Oz obviously too. But till the 4 people I would say would be most responsible but like Paul Williams and his music. Especially.

34:45.39
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah.

34:54.53
mikechumpchange
With the Muppet movie is like a huge part of it. Um, Michael Kane is like really the first and only person they decide. They want to get to play Ebenezer Scrooge for this movie and he makes a very specific choice in how he's going to play it and he says.

34:56.24
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, oh my God yeah.

35:13.10
mikechumpchange
I'm going to play Scrooge like I'm acting with the royal shakespeare company I'm never going to wink to camera I'm going to adjust my performance I am not going to adjust my performance at all because it's puppets I'm going to pretend that this is a very very sincere dramatic telling of a Christmas carol because I think that'll be. The funniest choice and that's really weird that he's like this will be actually humorous because I'm not winking at the camera.

35:41.68
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
It's the it's the old comedic. He's the straight man like the the idea that that humor is found in the honesty of a situation. So if you want to play the comedy Sometimes you have to play it straight? Um, let the muppets be as wacky as they're going to be and then he's just the guy going.

35:43.91
Rachel
And.

35:46.50
mikechumpchange
Um, roof.

35:51.79
mikechumpchange
Yeah.

35:58.52
mikechumpchange
Yeah, Rachel do will talk a lot more about Kane and his performance when we talk about the movie specifically. But do you find Kane's performance like funny overall there are humorous bits. But do you find it like humorous.

35:58.58
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Ah, this is happening I suppose.

36:13.76
Rachel
Um, I know I think he plays it just so straight that it not that it's not funny because he there is humor in sad and dark Situations. You know. But he plays it so seriously that it like amplifies the craziness around him and I think that really just like makes this movie what it is because I am a believer that it is a scary movie. It's a scary movie for kids and if he was goofing off and laughing.

36:32.46
mikechumpchange
Vu.

36:37.91
mikechumpchange
Yeah, yeah.

36:44.58
Rachel
You would be like look these funny ghosts. But he's terrified and he is horrified by how he's acted and his emotion and you need that to make it impactful. So I think he did he played it the way he had to I don't think it would have been nearly as good if he was cracking jokes and wink and like.

36:52.98
mikechumpchange
Okay. Yeah, when I when I think of like the straight men in comedy setting up the jokes I think of like but Abbot of Abbott and Costello like Larry fine from the 3 stooges perhaps like the greatest straight man of all time. Ah Dean Martin of like Martin and Lewis like. They are straight men that play it for laughs but this is there are funny bits but like Cain gives like ah especially over the summer we covered like jaws the revenge and it's a much different performance from Michael Caine

37:26.26
Rachel
Okay.

37:28.19
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

37:31.16
Rachel
Here.

37:33.67
mikechumpchange
Who is definitely not playing it like he's acting with a Royal shakespeare company into that movie me.

37:35.95
Rachel
No.

37:37.16
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Well I look I think and all respect to jaws. But I think the Muppets put a little more respect on their name please and thank you for sure. No question.

37:44.75
mikechumpchange
Yeah, better better puppeteering Muppet Christmasss Carol or jaws for what has better puppeteering. No question. Um, what if the ghost of cris future was played by like jaws. As for Shark though.

37:46.66
Rachel
Ah, truly who yeah, always met the Christmas Carol.

38:02.36
Rachel
Ah, that would be pretty great. Yeah.

38:02.71
mikechumpchange
Be amazing. Just swallows them uppple pan be pretty great. So the original idea of this food the way this was originally going to be played was it was going to be much more of a Spoof Henson says like the muppets at that point they're much more famous for questioning the status quo.

38:03.67
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Pretty ominous, pretty ominous.

38:21.96
mikechumpchange
And for anti-established ience irreverence so we took that and pointed it at Charles Dickens Robin the frog was going to be the ghost of Christmas past Miss Piggy was going to be this boclan allian ghost of Christmas present which is amazing and yeah I'd I think I would too.

38:36.62
Rachel
Yeah I'd watch that movie too.

38:37.40
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, that sounds incredible to me.

38:41.90
mikechumpchange
An animal was going to be the ghost of christmas yet to come although Henson has also said gonzo was going to be the ghost of christmas yet to come as well. So there's little hes this we were going to do a romping comedy.

38:45.17
Rachel
Ah.

38:50.29
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I've heard that and he was going to play it silent except for the nose would just be poking out of the hood.

38:58.23
Rachel
Ah.

39:00.82
mikechumpchange
Then they decide not to go that route because like Brian Henson decides like let's play it straight like let's actually give this material like the reverence it deserves and Henson's only 26 when he's given this and his father has just passed away. He's given. This multi that's hundreds of million Dollar empire to run. He doesn't want to direct this movie. He's tapped to direct and he's happy to do it when it's a made for television product. But as soon as Disney picks it up. He's like this is way too big a task and he is not directed. Anything at this point he is like headed puppeteering. He's working on that he's created he he's done a lot of creative work but he has not directed anything and he could not convince anybody else to take over for him. Um.

39:46.22
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Crime.

39:53.99
mikechumpchange
So he's like all right? Well I guess I'm stuck and he credits the calming influence in support of Frank Oz is keeping him in the directing chair like Frank Oz is like look I'm going to be with you the whole time. You've got this. You know what you're doing. He's like your dad will be watching over your shoulder from afar. But.

40:11.41
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Gonna.

40:11.75
mikechumpchange
I'm going to be right here with you as well like we're never going to let you get in over your head. Don't worry about it like we've we've got this, you're totally capable. Um, Michael Kaine went on to say he's like I did not know this was his first time directing like he did a bang-up job. He's like two weeks in he's like what do you mean? This is his first time like. You almost wonder if Cain would have been like oh I would have taken way more advantage of this guy if I knew this is um.

40:30.83
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, right I mean in terms of mentors. You can't really ask for better than Frank Oz I mean that man is a great director in his own right? So like yeah.

40:39.61
mikechumpchange
No yeah, absolutely.

40:46.59
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Ah, hard hard to go wrong with with that with when you when you've got the guy who directed little shop of horrors whispering in your ear the whole time. How how do you go wrong.

40:48.56
mikechumpchange
And no yeah, um, yeah, so.

40:53.81
Rachel
And it just shows what a like family of misfits both the muppets are and the people who made them are I feel like stories like that really it's why the muppets connect with people because it's not just Disney pouring money into these weird puppets. It's people who have built their own clan of wild muppets.

41:00.10
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah.

41:00.15
mikechumpchange
Down.

41:10.59
mikechumpchange
Yeah.

41:12.81
Rachel
And are making shit That's cool and I think that is why we love it so much because that feeling is there.

41:16.82
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah, and I think that's what made them up its hit as well and maybe that's part of the reason why they've not hit as well since I mean so many of those performers have started to sadly pass away and so they don't have that kind of.

41:23.25
Rachel
No.

41:32.19
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Band of misfits feeling anymore. It's become much more of a corporate organization and a corporate entity. Yeah, and so you don't feel that kind of love and camaraderie that those early years had because they were all in it together and they all shared that that love of it together. So yeah.

41:35.40
Rachel
Yeah, you have.

41:35.86
mikechumpchange
It's a job.

41:46.46
mikechumpchange
Yeah I think there's something to be said about like a Frank Oz a Steve Whitmore of ah Jim Henson creating and developing these characters and coming up with backstory and living with these characters. Through the 70 s the 80 s and part of the 90 s so that like it feels like a real part of you and it feels like a real kind of extension of yourself that you feel very protective of it and it seems like ridiculous to say like oh well Kermit the frog would never do that. Um, it's like what do you mean? It's like felt.

42:05.95
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Who.

42:21.23
mikechumpchange
Ah, you know cur with a frog will do whatever we tell it to do. There's a difference between having that sort of ownership versus kind of being a mercenary for hire that maybe you grew up in kind of loved these characters. But at the end of the day. It's like another just like it's a job It's a cv that you add. To your resume. There's like definitely a difference. That's there and I think Frank Oz like he actually penned a pretty long like letter saying specifically that like when the Disney Muppet movies came out like a lot of the actual like passion is not in and that's why he didn't return.

42:54.65
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah, yeah, that's a big part of what kept him out I think the one that he wanted to do after Jim's passing is the the the cheapest muppet movie ever made you guys heard the pitch for that one. It's basically.

43:07.38
mikechumpchange
Move.

43:07.88
Rachel
E is.

43:14.84
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Gonzo is allowed to direct the Muppet movie and he blows the entire budget on the opening credits and so the movie gets progressively cheaper as the movie goes on till the end they're literally just you're just looking at storyboard illustrations with the and with the the voices talking over them.

43:15.59
mikechumpchange
Who.

43:15.83
Rachel
I.

43:25.42
Rachel
But.

43:34.37
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And like that was the one that that oz really wanted to do I'm sure the script is out there somewhere. But yeah I just I want to see that movie get made and Disney they're they're too much of cowards to actually put it out.

43:44.56
mikechumpchange
If you find that script I would so do that for a script reading all right? So we have not none one in a couple years I would so do that and we would try to do them in character. Um, so.

43:47.21
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Challenge accepted Mike Challenge accepted

43:47.51
Rachel
Yes, yes.

43:59.87
mikechumpchange
Just had a quick note while like Henson's Muppet movies like they're obviously much lighter fare Brian's work did tend towards darker material like he is cutting his teeth on labyrinth in David Bowie's terrifying cod piece I think the reason i.

44:14.51
Rachel
Ah, terrifying What are you talking about? Yeah like oh okay.

44:15.72
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, I was going to say terrified mike.

44:19.30
mikechumpchange
I am like not a huge fan of David Bowie personally I understand why people love David Bowie like I'm not someone who's like Bowie sucks I'm like no I get why people love him. The reason I'm not a fan of David Bowie is like literally labyrinth and that cod piece and that wig I'm like nope not for me.

44:35.91
Rachel
Ah.

44:38.23
mikechumpchange
Um, the storyteller television series like this darker more adult fair like that's where Brian is getting his start and he's getting. He's says in an interview that came out just last year to celebrate the thirtieth anniversary. He's talking to entertainment entertainment weekly and talking about quote being too terrified to direct the movie. He's getting notes back from Disney and Abc and I think Jeffrey Katzberg and the notes literally say like this could be a lot funnier like. You know he's saying the typical setup of the muppet scripts like every page has at least 2 jokes or 2 gags on it but this material or playing it straight like it's definitely funny, but we're not necessarily going for gags so when they're filming this and seeing the material like they're getting notes back. It's like. Where are the jokes. So yeah, musically this is a comeback movie for Paul Williams he had written music for the Muppet movie but had fallen on hard times in the intervening years after penning a string of hits in the 70 s through ax as huge as the carpenters like rainy days and Mondays and we've only just begun he had played the phantom for diplomama and phantom of the paradise which I've never seen because I think I think I again confuse that with like the kiss phantom.

45:56.50
Rachel
Yes.

45:58.56
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Same.

46:03.94
Rachel
And.

46:05.93
mikechumpchange
I always mix that movie up and I'm like I don't want to watch a movie with Kiss and it's a depama movie. So ah, Williams connected with like Henson and the muppets after that. But in the 80 s he had found himself with a crippling addiction to cocaine and alcohol.

46:05.97
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Are.

46:11.53
Rachel
That's fair.

46:24.10
mikechumpchange
It wasn't until the end of the decade before he felt ready to check himself into rehab when he emerged sober and ready to tackle songwriting again. It was only two months later when his friend Jim Henson died um he said composed getting to compose the songs for a muppet Christmas Carol.

46:35.70
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
A.

46:44.25
mikechumpchange
Williams found himself drawn to the story of scrooge and he found it like a redemption story and he found a hook in a man learning to live life. A new way learning to live with a new appreciation for it after a spiritual awakening. There's anecdote he told about. Recording sessions in London during June of Ninety Two Williams went to introduce himself to Michael Kane saying hey it's great to meet you a longtime fan and Kain looked at him and he's like dude we met years ago like we actually spent a whole weekend together.

47:16.57
Rachel
Ah.

47:17.48
mikechumpchange
Like for days at the white elephant gambling among other things and Williams like yeah I don't remember anything about that. So ah, yeah, we'll talk a lot more about the music when we talk about the movie. So yes, he did.

47:22.67
Rachel
Yeah, yeah.

47:28.68
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Oh yeah.

47:31.12
Rachel
Did he do um, Emmett too didn't he. That's why I thought yeah.

47:36.18
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Written up written by Jerry Jewell as well. So.

47:36.97
mikechumpchange
You know? Yeah, so he's a long time staple and he talked about like why he connected with and we'll I guess we'll talk about it. We talk about the movie like he appeared on the Muppet show and.

47:52.30
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yes.

47:55.36
mikechumpchange
After a song he performs with Rolf the dog he like rolfph says oh that's pretty sad isn't it and he touches Ralf's hand and he says I didn't feel like I was touching the puppet. He felt like I was touching in an actual character like that's how he was connecting with him and I think that is like. What the muppets bring to the table like you don't feel like you're connecting with like a person that's playing a character you feel like you're connecting with these actual beings. So and I guess we'll talk about that in a few minutes here a little more in depth. But.

48:25.98
Rachel
Yes, yes.

48:27.00
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Bryant.

48:32.64
mikechumpchange
Um, this movie's not a hit upon its initial release which is kind of shocking because it's so beloved comes out during a super crowded holiday landscape and there's also a lot of other family friendly movies that come out during this time.

48:43.87
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

48:49.33
mikechumpchange
Ah, it has to go against the juggernaut that is like home alone to which is a horror movie and we could should cover it as such ah home alone too is I think next Christmas we're either doing home alone or a Christmas story.

48:51.46
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right? Yes, are you? What do you say? we're going to cover the home alone franchise next year

48:59.26
Rachel
Ah.

49:02.38
Rachel
Here.

49:06.64
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Okay, right on.

49:07.66
Rachel
Oh love that? okay.

49:09.20
mikechumpchange
As our Christmas day movie 1 of those 2 um I'm kind of leaning a Christmas story because that movie's such a banger and I love Bob Clark um your black Christmas episodes by the way listen to the first 2 on disenfranchise were absolute bangers.

49:24.79
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Oh thank you so much. The third 1 honestly, the third one's my favorite like Nicole just brings it in that episode she is she she is absolutely.

49:28.49
mikechumpchange
By the way Stephen. Okay well, the call's wonderful. Ariel was wonderful by the way.

49:37.90
Rachel
I thought you meant the third black Christmas was your favorite of the black christmases and I was like I got to go guys.

49:41.20
mikechumpchange
No nope no, it's the Bob Clark 1 for sure I disagree with your co-host on theires of Bob Clark's movie. They're out of their mind you thinking some? um.

49:43.77
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, no I I also disagree with them on that assessment.

49:59.24
mikechumpchange
But it goes against home alone too which is like taking all the money. Also Aladdin is still in theaters at that point so like Disney is kind of cannibalizing itself a little bit there. So muppet Christmas Caro opens in sixth place on December Eleventh it takes in only like 5000000

50:03.30
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Leaving.

50:18.53
mikechumpchange
Um, home alone 2 in its fourth weekend pulls in about eight point three million to kind of give you an idea of how that movie was doing to pull in over 100000000 a few good men opened at number 1 Um, so.

50:24.66
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Rain.

50:27.90
Rachel
Yikes.

50:32.83
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Look They couldn't handle the truth I'm saying.

50:36.49
Rachel
Ah.

50:36.54
mikechumpchange
There you go So the muppets could not handle the box office is what is what we're saying here very good. Um, now we used to be a country that could produce things.

50:45.28
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I'm looking at the box office right now that is an insane and insane top 10 that weekend for a variety of things and not just the same cookie cutter thing over and over again.

50:52.20
Rachel
Yeah, yes.

50:54.99
mikechumpchange
Yeah, yeah, we used to be a nation that was so I convinced my daughter we're gonna see I think Christmas day we're going to see the iron claw. Why she's 13 yeah because the Alamo draft house. Everything is sold out. We're going to go see Wonka um I've been told poor things would be.

51:02.94
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Oh right on.

51:02.98
Rachel
Okay, okay.

51:13.77
mikechumpchange
Completely inappropriate for a 13 year old um so maybe we'll hold off I don't know but she's pretty mature but an iron claw. We're going to go see um because you know what is Christmas without a lot of tragedy. So yeah.

51:21.93
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Bright on.

51:26.86
Rachel
Um, yeah, so yes.

51:27.67
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Correct.

51:31.86
mikechumpchange
I've got a ker von eric story super quick. So Ker Von Eric was doing a book signing when I was in fourth grade and I went I bought my book I waited in a line there were thousands of kids but I had to leave to go to church because it was an altar boy. So I wasn't going to get my book signed so he left the mall was a walden books of the mall.

51:44.19
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
A.

51:51.29
mikechumpchange
And as we're walking to my car his limo pulls up an hour late probably because he was doing drugs because that was Ker Von Eric I mean that's fair assumption and I run up to him like Mr Von Ek Mr Von Erik I was waiting in line to get you to sign my book and I bought it and.

52:00.31
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Bright.

52:08.79
mikechumpchange
Can you please sign it I got to go to church and he looked at me. He's like no and he walked away and I'm like fucker and I'm like eight nine I'm like fuck that so I ran after him and followed him into the back of the bookstore.

52:17.20
Rachel
Ah.

52:19.56
Rachel
Can.

52:26.36
mikechumpchange
And like please please please like no and the door shuts behind me and it was one of those weird latching doors. So I couldn't open it and they just pull him to the front of the store I'm locked in the back of like a walden books. My dad's pounding on the door I'm crying.

52:41.57
Rachel
Oh.

52:41.92
mikechumpchange
Security had to escort me out through thousands of people so you know some of the von Eric deaths. Yeah, so some of the von Eric deaths were very tragic.

52:44.39
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Oh my God Just when I thought this story couldn't get better. It does.

52:55.31
Rachel
Um, yeah.

52:57.75
mikechumpchange
Not carry von Eric in my opinion Anyway, go see the iron claw all right stephen you have a note here about the box office of the muppets. So take it away.

53:01.10
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Ah.

53:05.70
Rachel
Um, yeah.

53:12.29
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Ah, no I'm I mean I'm just I'm just looking at it here like in terms of hang on. Let me let me check overall like franchise this I mean I don't think this one does particularly well overall for the franchise.

53:15.74
Rachel
So.

53:28.30
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
But I think more than anything in terms of this one becoming a classic since it didn't do really well in theaters I think the home video really really helps I mean that's how I first experienced it was on home video I think most but because clearly I didn't say it in theaters this film only gross less than 30000000 in its entire run.

53:33.31
mikechumpchange
Remove.

53:45.67
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah.

53:46.57
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, so like people didn't go to theaters to see this. So I think the way most people engage with it is on home video and it becomes the juggernaut cook I mean most people will probably argue. This is one of the greatest Christmas films of all time now people you know my age the the.

53:59.25
mikechumpchange
Oh yes.

54:04.54
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Exennial age and I mean it's just become the the standard. Um but I didn't know when I until I watched it on Disney plus a couple years ago I didn't know that the song um, ah the love is gone was not in the movie I had never seen a version of this. Movie without the love is gone. It's still not back on Disney plus by the way because I watched it on Disney plus the other day and I didn't see it there. It's not there now I watched it tuesday.

54:29.81
Rachel
Same with Hulu they cut it out on there too.

54:31.68
mikechumpchange
I think it's there was there last year you might have to choose like the act might have to go into extras and it might be in there with that version. We watched it last year with it.

54:35.95
Rachel
And.

54:42.47
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Oh okay, but yeah I didn't I didn't know that and that of course Katzenberg famously cut that song because he thought kids would get bored. Um, which I mean as a kid who watched the movie. Yes I did get bored with it. But I think I as an adult now I appreciate it.

54:54.76
mikechumpchange
And.

54:59.67
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
A lot more as part of Scrooge's arc and kind of understanding him more as a character and it's such. It's it's a beautiful song um like it. It really is ah a beautiful song but I think Katzenberg's like look you got this slow downer number. Um kids want to see the muppets. They're going to get bored out of their minds.

55:01.61
mikechumpchange
Who.

55:19.30
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Take the shit out of there and so they they cut that song and I had never seen a version of it without until just a couple years until a grown until I was a grown ass man right? I agree.

55:28.29
Rachel
It belongs in there leave it in I think it's so important I'm like maybe I'm like I just think that it's one of the first times you see this like massive humanization of scrooge which is a huge part of this I think yeah.

55:28.44
mikechumpchange
Rate.

55:42.71
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Exactly.

55:45.80
Rachel
The muppets aren't in it but they're watching it with you and I feel like Gonzo and Rizzo are the perfect guide to your emotional reaction to the movie if you're not sure how you feel there they are. They're crying I cried every time in it as a kid sometimes I still do because it.

55:54.50
mikechumpchange
Of love.

55:58.49
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, yeah.

56:01.39
Rachel
It may being sad and lonely especially at the holidays it hits whether or not you realize that's why you're crying at it like so many people are sad and alone not with the people they love or have ruined relationships with the people they love at Christmas and to watch it like brutally performed right there for you. And then it transitions because how else are you going to cut from Christmas past to Christmas present. He's sad. He morphs onto his betty lays down heartbroken I think it's a beautiful transition into like pow of Christmas present.

56:29.70
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah, my green.

56:30.67
mikechumpchange
Know interesting point. Yeah I don't think maybe because like I never I'd watched this so many times without that song in it I get really only heard it in the context of the credits but that is a good point that it does you do see Kane like.

56:34.52
Rachel
Look.

56:40.70
Rachel
1

56:50.70
mikechumpchange
Sobbing at the end like after his he's hearing it I think that is a good point. The way you put it like especially with like people that sabotage their own relationships and maybe thinking about it this time of year. Um, 1 quick note because you mentioned home video Stephen.

56:59.62
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah.

57:09.69
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

57:10.40
mikechumpchange
Ah, Dvd of this if you put the Dvd in and just leave it on the home the menu and don't hit play Kermit just gets more and more exasperated waiting for you to hit play. It's amazing. He's like just gets angry by the end of it but not in a way that.

57:14.17
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Are. I Love that.

57:25.40
Rachel
I.

57:27.76
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, I think that's amazing.

57:29.84
mikechumpchange
Not like angry in a way that I would get angry like he gets kermit the frog angry. So so it's pretty great. Oh oh.

57:34.28
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right? There's there's something similar to that on the U hf dvd as well. Um, weird weird out will show up and just get more and more pissed the longer you wait and don't hit play. It's really fun. It's great.

57:40.10
Rachel
1

57:46.92
mikechumpchange
I love that movie so much. Okay, so let's dive into it right here. Um, we touched on it briefly so I apologize if amassing this a second time but Kane's decision because I think we got to start. With Michael Kane playing Ebenezer Scrooge straight I feel like it does a great job of balancing this movie out because I think the muppets add so much humor to it I think that his performance is scrooge. Has so much emotional heft and gravitas to it and he's such a great performer anyway, where do you feel like his performance ranks amongst the scrooge performances and how do you feel he does here and I don't think anyone's going to say he sucks because we're.

58:35.24
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, no right? Yeah boo. No I I love I Love his performance I Love what he's doing I think.

58:37.22
mikechumpchange
Talking about this movie an hour in so spoiler. He's the worst.

58:38.50
Rachel
Ah.

58:49.70
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Particularly because Henson Brian is wanting to kind of shift away from the stuff that his dad did it makes sense that this is the movie. He wants to make and Michael Kane is making the best decision for that movie for sure. I. Know of a lot of Muppet fans who do not enjoy this movie as much as some other films in the Muppet franchise because of Kane's performance because it's not It's it's too grounded. It's not they don't they don't consider this a Muppet movie. Consider this just a Christmas carol adaptation that happens to have muppets in it. Um, and I I understand where they're coming from I don't agree to be clear I do not agree with them. Um, but I just feel like I should at least voice the frustrations of a subset of the muppet fandom. Um, who don't necessarily kind of see the the appeal of this compared to some of the other films in the franchise. Um ah compared specifically maybe to Tim Curry in Muppet Treasure Island who is chewing all of the scenery in that movie. Um, just absolutely making a meal out of it. Um, and it definitely feels like that performance is a pivot away in that movie in general is kind of a pivot away from this one in a way that that that's more of a parody than it is a direct literary adaptation whereas this is I think purely a literary adaptation. It's very clear that.

01:00:12.74
mikechumpchange
Review.

01:00:19.79
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Brian is wanting to try something new with these with these characters that hadn't really been done to this degree before which I think is in and of itself an interesting exercise and it fits very much the model that henson and his father Jim Henson established in the early Muppet films that in the great muppet caper they set up. Okay. We're not Kermit Fosy Gonzo the guys you know were actors playing characters in this other story and setting it up like that and so that's kind of how this sets up and you've got you know gonzo as dickens telling the story and then all of them up it kind of fit in there and then.

01:00:43.70
mikechumpchange
Remove.

01:00:54.25
mikechumpchange
Now yeah, what are your thoughts Rachel.

01:00:56.96
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Michael Cain just fucking delivering just pile driving is the performance of scrooge for sure.

01:01:03.15
Rachel
I think I can't imagine a movie where he was more comedic but also I think the fact his like seriousness at times is almost comedic like there's this one scene where the kid's outside caroling the rabbit and he opens the door and he looks up for a human and like.

01:01:19.13
mikechumpchange
Move.

01:01:22.71
Rachel
That's so funny without having to be funny. He's seriously mad. He's expecting someone else that you don't have to be like cracking jokes and be in Mr. Goofy to pull off such a beautiful moment of humor that is done because he's serious. So I think I don't know I think. Also the beauty of muppet movies is they can be anything so I think that that's what makes this the muppetiest movie of all because they're like no, we're doing dickens and that's like the joy of it. So I don't know I think he is brilliant and I think if I don't know that I like the movie so much if he was funny like you need the serious you need the like.

01:01:40.63
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, yeah.

01:01:53.31
mikechumpchange
Now.

01:01:59.34
Rachel
And to he shuffles you through the emotional impact of the story and then you have the muppets there to be the one who make it not just a straight shot.

01:02:09.20
mikechumpchange
Um, I and you also talked about how this movie is a horror movie for children.

01:02:16.36
Rachel
It is. It's a scary ass movie I think we get so like it's a kids movie. It is and like that's because people you know you look at puppets you think kids I'm like no I love Muppets I'm a grown ass woman and I will always love a muppet. Um, but I think it's a. Boooky Ghost Story it the way they do it in some ways with even the muppets are afraid the muppets are showing this like deep sense of terror and fear that you don't really see another kind of Muppet movies and it makes it scary. Yeah, which as a kid when I remember being scared of it I was like well like.

01:02:40.49
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
To the that gonzo and Rizzo just piece out of the movie at the end.

01:02:50.60
Rachel
If you have to go they left. You know you're like my buds couldn't handle it but you can so it gives you this like sense of camaraderie to it. Um, and I think it is truly a scary scary movie not compared to now that we've watched so many scarier movies but like when and scrooge is scared.

01:02:50.23
mikechumpchange
The.

01:02:52.49
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right.

01:03:08.36
Rachel
If he wasn't scared. Why would we be scared but the way he is fearful of what's going on around him. You're like oh shit, why is he afraid of you know these goofy ass ghosts that we know in love from another movie but he's scared so I should be like.

01:03:08.48
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right.

01:03:14.80
mikechumpchange
Now.

01:03:20.12
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
It it leans I think it works also because it's leaning into the sincerity like so often you know you've got that kind of 90 s post irony thing that kind of pervades pop culture and I think the reason this works so well is that it doesn't fall into that trap and it.

01:03:29.86
Rachel
O.

01:03:39.39
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
It is this movie is achingly sincere and I think cain playing it the way that he does helps push that sincerity and helps promote that sincerity which I think is again the secret weapon of this movie.

01:03:44.58
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah, and I think to that degree like in order to make dickens moral lesson work in order to sell the change that Ebenezer Scrooge goes through. In this like if the scrooge has to go through the ringer and he has to come through the other end of this night a changed man in order for a Christmas carol to have any sort of emotional impact and an order for any lesson to be learned if.

01:04:02.56
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:04:19.23
mikechumpchange
Throughout this movie like Kane is like cracking jokes in wiseaccres and like doing Pratt falls if he's doing that sort of thing throughout the movie like why you know if he's like shaking his fist at a comical way at Bob Cratcht going like why I'm going to get you Bob for turning up the. Ah, Cole like if he's doing that throughout then he doesn't really learn anything but it doesn't appear that he learns anything by the end of it. It doesn't come off like the lesson really isn't learned and by making him as repugnant as they do at the start of this movie as. Making him is kind of scary and I think part of it too is like the way Henson films Michael Kaine and this and some of the flourishes that he uses with the camera angles and the musical cues that are used with the score because he's able to do that because we're able to take Michael Cain seriously at the end when he comes out of this a changed person children and adults like see that lesson and I think you wouldn't get that otherwise so I do appreciate Kane's choice although I love like I love joking around that like at the end of this movie when he's sitting at the table singing. Um, not um, yes when he's singing the love we found I just he has this look in his eye where he's just like I'm freaking out here man like you could tell like he's like just feels a little weirded out like I love to imagine cain was like.

01:05:38.28
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
The love we found.

01:05:38.62
Rachel
The lovely you found.

01:05:49.60
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:05:55.95
mikechumpchange
Dripping balls the whole time he was filming this movie and didn't realize he was like filming against puppets. He just thought these were like magical real creatures. Um I just would like to imagine that is my head again and um.

01:05:59.23
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:06:04.16
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I Love that that is had again and now.

01:06:05.74
Rachel
And truly.

01:06:13.37
mikechumpchange
Our thoughts on gonzo as our omniscient narrator as Mr Charles Dickens himself with Rizzo the rat.

01:06:16.80
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Perfect I I love their pairing is kind of a revelation and I think based on what I read I again stumbled on Steve Whitmere's blog this morning when I was just like.

01:06:17.88
Rachel
Yeah perfection.

01:06:34.96
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Dicking around on the internet and um, he someone asked him about what he remembers from muppet family Christmas and they talk about how much they love the pairing of the turkey that he plays in that with gonzo and then the pairing of Gonzo and Rizzo in this and he i. Put this little blurb in the notes here about him reminiscing about that. Um about his relationship with Dave Gells at that stage after the fragal years Dave and I had developed an amazing chemistry between us. We were like an old married couple who can look at each other and intuit what the other was thinking. And often about to say our sense of each other's timing was virtually telepathic. Um and then he goes and tells a goofy story about how they used to get indian food in Toronto um, and and how Steve didn't know how to pronounce anything. Um. But like I think it works because the 2 of them are so are so connected as performers that their relationship feels as organic and again, that's I think what works about the muppets is it. The relationships between the characters are the relationships between the performers and I think that works so well here.

01:07:31.50
mikechumpchange
Um.

01:07:43.54
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And it gives maybe people who aren't as familiar with the story kids coming into this and for them like you Rachel being your first exposure to this story like it gives you kind of the the intro that you need kind of the in that you need to be able to to follow the story and to to relate to these characters. Um, and and it's it's a very kind of but aot Lou Costello kind of relationship and that you've got gonzo weirddely playing it straight for most of the movie and then Rizzo kind of being you know the goofball and then occasionally gonzo getting like a fun line like oh you have all the fun after. Falls down the chimney and lands on a flaming hot goose and you know stuff you get you get kind of those echoes of the character that gonzo is and it's it I can't imagine those lines are actually scripted and pretty sure those have to be something that they came up with like when they were riffing and there's like fine we're we're writing that in that's great. That's amazing.

01:08:36.43
Rachel
Or.

01:08:38.24
mikechumpchange
Yeah, Rachel what are your thoughts on this pairing of of Gonzo and Rizzo and and how they work specifically like as a narrating duo.

01:08:49.69
Rachel
I don't know I just think with you have like 1 person telling the story which is like for me like you said it was my first time seeing it I didn't know any of this. In fact I thought there were 2 marleys the whole time until I got older and I was like wait. There's only one of them. We gotta have both.

01:08:59.71
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:09:06.47
Rachel
Um, so having that framework definitely helps. But then I just feel like wise cracking Rizzo in it in your ear saying all those little like wise ass things you're thinking when you're watching movie. You're just like yeah well this is stupid and oops I left my food and like. He is the v he felt like it's like the two sides of your you have Charles Dickens and you have your thoughts that you're watching so it's almost like they're live streaming my thoughts of the movie while it's happening so I'm like you've got both, you've got and so it's just perfect. It's the it's the narrative I needed for that movie and I love gonzo I think he.

01:09:31.95
mikechumpchange
Um.

01:09:37.68
mikechumpchange
Down. He's up there. He's just awesome. He's and they you mentioned like abbe and Costello like I think that in the the best the muppets work their best I think when they are.

01:09:40.45
Rachel
He's my favorite muppet So I'm a gozo Afishionado. It's great.

01:09:41.51
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah up there for me too.

01:09:55.64
mikechumpchange
Kind of like mining those like Vaudeville routes like that live performance that back and forth like the banter like that is when the muppets I think are at their best when they're kind of doing that kind of cornball kind of comedy but yet they make it work and I think that there are.

01:09:56.16
Rachel
A he.

01:09:57.37
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Absolutely.

01:10:07.88
Rachel
In a.

01:10:13.92
mikechumpchange
So many cute little moments at work here like there's that little joke when Rizzo is like I know this story like the back of my hand and versus like prove it and gonzo just starts describing the back of his hand like that gets me every single time. Um.

01:10:16.96
Rachel
Ah.

01:10:20.26
Rachel
Our.

01:10:27.92
Rachel
Yes.

01:10:31.60
mikechumpchange
Just little physical bits like after this huge and henson described this as one of his favorite moments in the movie and it doesn't do anything that you could cut it from the movie and nothing would be missed when they're behind Scrooge's bed chambers and. Like allowing Scrooge basically to go from his door to his bedroom and they are trying to get into his yard and Rizzo is perched at the top of the fence and he's like oh I you know I don't want to jump down I don't want to jump please you know, but go. Save my poor broken body and he jumps and then he's like oh I forgot my bag of food and he just goes and he walks through the fence and walks back in. It's such a great and he's like what like doesn't even consider what he just did.

01:11:09.39
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:11:23.25
mikechumpchange
And then Kisses Gonzo's nose I love that bit and you could cut that completely but it works and it just explains their dynamic so well.

01:11:23.60
Rachel
Perspective.

01:11:27.98
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, yeah.

01:11:31.74
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And I think it's no go ahead. Rachel no please.

01:11:31.96
Rachel
And I think oh sorry I was just say I just think they have a lot of physical comedy between the 2 of them which is funny when you think of them as being on so other people's hands I don't when you watch him they feel like 2 people. But when he's like.

01:11:39.57
mikechumpchange
Um, moved.

01:11:42.50
mikechumpchange
Who. Um, yeah, move? Yeah move.

01:11:48.70
Rachel
Scrubbing the window with it. He's like thanks for making me a or even stoking the fire with him like they don't even mention it. It's a second pan over of this moment. That's just so physically funny and that I don't think I don't know it's It's my favorite part about him.

01:11:51.59
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:11:55.90
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, right? he.

01:12:02.49
mikechumpchange
Yeah minute.

01:12:03.58
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And I think Disney has tried to recapture that sense like Muppet haunted mansion. You get like the pair and gonzos kind of become the stalwart because Dave Gells is the only guy left of the original guard that's still willing to do muppet things and gonzo is his character so gonzo kind of takes the lead on a lot of these projects now.

01:12:08.76
Rachel
My.

01:12:23.13
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
But um, you've got youve they pair him with Pepe the prawn which I don't like Pepe the prawn I don't like that character at all I'm not a fan but I don't think that dynamic works half as well because Bill Barretta and Dave Gells don't have the same level of chemistry that that Dave and Steve did.

01:12:28.85
mikechumpchange
Yeah.

01:12:30.79
Rachel
Um, un low. Okay.

01:12:41.46
mikechumpchange
Um, know no comedy troops and comedy pairings are hard and it's difficult. That's why even when when Abbott and Costello split up.

01:12:42.60
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, and so it it feels lacking and it feels like you're trying to make something where there isn't something and I don't like that they are.

01:12:46.57
Rachel
Um, yeah, yeah, um.

01:12:57.14
mikechumpchange
They broke up as a pair and then they tried to get back together for a company couple comedy specials like by that point like the timing was off and think there were other issues like health issues at play as well like it no longer worked is like okay our time kind of passed.

01:13:11.94
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
M.

01:13:14.53
mikechumpchange
And we'll talk about that in a couple of months when we do ab and Costello meets Frankenstein. Um, the other thing though is like what works for them as narrators is number one like you said Steve like threequarters of what gonzo says is straight from the novel like he's just straight up narrating from the book.

01:13:30.28
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah.

01:13:32.38
mikechumpchange
So he's acting as that and and then Rizzo is acting as like the Greek chorus and saying like you had said Rachel what kids might be thinking when they're watching this and kind of keeping it moving along here but they also are acting as audience surrogates like when the movie is getting scary or serious. They're matching the tone of the material on screen. They're no longer acting zany and there are 2 parts like 1 part. They actually tell you like hey we're leaving we'll be act. We'll be back for the finale like that's when the ghosts of christmas.

01:13:56.42
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, and then.

01:14:05.77
mikechumpchange
Ah of yet to come comes in like this is too scary for us. We're out of here. We're going to grab a burrito. The other part of it though is like they're not in Scrooge's bed chambers when Marley and Marley show up but they don't tell you that.

01:14:21.78
mikechumpchange
But they're not there and the tone of that scene, especially the first part of it is markedly different from the rest of it. It's much more somber. It's a little bit spookier to your point Rachel it's a ghost story and you feel that change you feel it with the music you feel it with the selection. You feel it with the camera angles. Scrooge has gone from this larger than life character to feeling much smaller and much more vulnerable and I think in part of that works because if you had gonzo and Rizzo they're kind of cracking jokes like that would break that tension so they know when to not use them too which I think is great.

01:14:59.91
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:15:00.81
mikechumpchange
So Speaking of being used what are your thoughts in general of like all of these other Muppet roles like how are they cast. How are they assigned? What do you think works here what stands out for both of you because I'm I'm talking a lot today. So I'm going to take a breather for a minute. So. What stands out for y'all.

01:15:17.63
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Got it Rachel.

01:15:18.71
Rachel
I mean obviously Kermit is Bob cratchit I feel like when I see Bob cratcher someone says Bob Cratchett I think of Kermit his spirit is that and so like obviously not obviously has to be him but I feel like that's the obvious choice. You want that tender kind character to be him.

01:15:22.42
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah.

01:15:24.89
mikechumpchange
Um, vu.

01:15:35.94
mikechumpchange
Um.

01:15:38.60
Rachel
Um I think like Fozzy is 1 they did super well obviously just even though it's for 2 scenes you know he's one at the factory and then one at the end is old Fozzy like that goofy character is exactly who Scrooge's fun loving boss would be I think.

01:15:40.35
mikechumpchange
Yeah.

01:15:53.10
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Ryan.

01:15:56.30
Rachel
Miss Piggy is the one that I'm like yeah she would have been a great bocchanalian modern day goddess but like the pissed off wife of this poor meek man whose kids are dying and has nothing to eat and she's just done pretending. She's okay with all this shit like it's classic piggy. So like again her perfect role I don't think. There's anyone that doesn't fit even the little ones like you see the swedish chef for a second role plays the piano for a second you have all these little moments where they don't don't feel like they have to force every character to be this muppet but they pop up for a second. They're like yeah, it's a Muppet movie. Of course here we are.

01:16:26.24
mikechumpchange
Um.

01:16:27.88
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right? I think picky is the one that I had the toughest time with growing up because she's a star. You know she needs to be front and center. Why are we? where are we sidelining her like I could in another version of this I could see her playing Scrooge's love interest.

01:16:34.30
Rachel
Um, oh yeah, and.

01:16:42.73
Rachel
Yeah, yeah.

01:16:44.75
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
But it feels like well Kermit's obviously Cratchet. So she's then obviously has to be Mrs Cratchet and I don't think the role. It's been a while since I've read the original dickens novel but that role I feel like they they've suited piggy to that role. They're like okay since since Piggy has to play this character. Now we need to make this into a piggy character and so you get her being a lot more assertive and I'm going to raise you right? off the pavement and all that stuff that she does which I think ends up working really well. But I remember when I was younger being like I think piggy deserves more than this.

01:17:11.31
Rachel
Um, so.

01:17:21.29
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
But I've come around to it and I like how they use her even though I think in in any other adaptation that would be a very thankless role.

01:17:27.98
Rachel
And I think a lot of it is like gender roles of the time like you're not going to have a woman screaming in someone's face and she tries she does raise your off the pave but the minute she realizes. She's wrong. She's so like I she truly so she is.

01:17:32.11
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, yeah.

01:17:41.85
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, yeah, which is still a very piggy thing to do.

01:17:45.17
mikechumpchange
Um.

01:17:46.65
Rachel
And that's why I think it works is because this is a telling of the Christmas story with muppets like obviously if it was she could be scrooge in the way that she is in a different version of this movie but just playing her as a smaller bit part and she still has her bit. She could tell she's in charge of the family you know and she's like.

01:17:50.35
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Why.

01:17:57.64
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:18:06.60
Rachel
It does doesn't it and she's so proud of her meal. He's bringing piggy to the role of this or like the role that they were going with it. But I feel it.

01:18:07.77
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:18:08.51
mikechumpchange
Um.

01:18:12.64
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah, yeah, they they definitely elevate. She elevates the material I think that that like her kind of elevating that role from what dickens had probably originally intended it for it to be and I think them putting her there gave them and gave them some more opportunities to use her for comedy which.

01:18:23.89
Rachel
Um.

01:18:29.28
Rachel
Right? But you always want more piggy. There's never a Mu it would be that you don't want more piggy feel. You have not.

01:18:31.82
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I Appreciate always like yeah I I Definitely yeah I And again, she's the star like that's just that's core to her character fundamental to who she is so I just wanted to see like a lot of a lot of piggy.

01:18:41.20
Rachel
Yes, and he.

01:18:49.37
Rachel
Yeah, yeah.

01:18:50.90
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
For sure. Um, but yeah, no I agree with you I don't think there's anyone that's really miscast here. There are charactergis of course I want to see a lot more of like I I love the electric mayhem I'm kind of bummed. They're really relegated just to the fuzzy way Christmas party I'm bummed Fozzy is only relegated to the fuzzy with Christmas party quite frankly like.

01:18:52.22
mikechumpchange
Um.

01:18:59.71
Rachel
Aha.

01:19:04.74
Rachel
Right.

01:19:07.97
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Because you're dealing with a story that has a lot of very small characters. You've got to kind of spread your cast and put them where they need to go but in doing that. Unfortunately you miss a lot of moments with a lot of your favorite muppets like you know I love fozzy I love Dr Teeth I love the swedish chef and I don't see nearly as much of them in this movie as i.

01:19:19.84
mikechumpchange
Move.

01:19:26.58
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
As I would otherwise right which is not enough not nearly enough time for me.

01:19:27.43
Rachel
Seconds you see seconds of them right? agreed.

01:19:29.18
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah I mean there's so much going on in the background in this movie where they do create ancillary characters that you know they're just and you could have maybe used them. In the background where you would recognize them I don't know if that would detract from the story where you're like oh there's like the Swedish Chef kind of hawking his way wheres like there's the guy with a boomerang fish like selling his stuff. Ah maybe that would have taken away.

01:19:55.41
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Part of point of order Mike his name is Lou Zealand

01:20:01.11
mikechumpchange
Thank you I could not remember his name. Um, maybe that would have taken away from like watching the movie. But I think I would have liked to have seen that I love fozzy so much and what I love is that all of the characters. Although they're playing parts in a movie and I do love at 1 point when like.

01:20:10.33
Rachel
We have.

01:20:19.43
mikechumpchange
Gonzo literally leans into Sam The Ego Eagle like I was like you forgot your lines on stage and is like we're in Britain and Sam is like it is the british way.

01:20:24.49
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah, that gets me every time I laugh every time it's it's such a silly small and then like Sam kind of like looks at him after he walks on stage.

01:20:26.94
Rachel
Ah, yeah, every day.

01:20:39.29
Rachel
Um, yeah, like.

01:20:39.88
mikechumpchange
Um, Boom Yeah no.

01:20:40.69
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Like Sam's like the but okay like just kind of looks over at of and I'm I 8 kills me every time I laugh.

01:20:46.20
mikechumpchange
Um, there's also a little line he has that I never caught it until last night ads like they're zooming out on the ghost and Michael Kane you hear Sam Go remember you don't tip the track.

01:20:50.38
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And.

01:20:59.95
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, yes, yeah, um.

01:21:01.60
Rachel
Um, if you.

01:21:02.79
mikechumpchange
Which is such as sam the eagle thing that' say um, the thing that worries me is Fozzy is green at the end of this movie I'm like why it's wasi green that does not look good. That's not a good look. Um.

01:21:08.28
Rachel
Ah, me.

01:21:15.13
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah, the only time we see him look like that is when in that picture in Muppet great muppet caper when Kermit and fozzy are playing brothers and they're like what does your dad look like and it's it's Fozzy's body with Kermit's eyes and Kermit's frail and the fur is completely green and it yeah.

01:21:17.14
Rachel
Um, now.

01:21:26.14
Rachel
Um, here then.

01:21:29.22
Rachel
Yes, no.

01:21:30.79
mikechumpchange
Um, now it's not good, not good now. It's a thing of not as much of a nightmare before we talk about Marley and Marley I'll point out fred's.

01:21:33.50
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
It looks It looks very disturbing.

01:21:36.39
Rachel
Are.

01:21:45.76
mikechumpchange
Christmas party the muppets that he are hosting. There are the things of like love crafty and nightmares like I don't know where he finds these creatures I don't know what they're doing there. They're horrifying. Um i.

01:21:46.70
Rachel
A.

01:21:47.69
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, oh yes.

01:21:55.81
Rachel
Yeah, no.

01:22:01.14
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
How did they get into upper cross Mupp and society.

01:22:04.34
Rachel
But truly.

01:22:05.58
mikechumpchange
I Don't know like who designed them and who thought these would be good creatures for this movie like they're terrifying. They're absolutely oh my god.

01:22:15.45
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, but I love them I love them I love them so much. Oh yes, the big heads. Yeah.

01:22:17.38
Rachel
They remind me of the neighbors in Rocco modern life I don't know why tell you about with the like the yeah something about the shape of their mouths and the warts. Yeah, that's what they always remind me of is a version.

01:22:25.22
mikechumpchange
Um, you you expect them to open their mouth and for like tiny Tim's legs to be sticking out of their mouth like they just like what do you live? We serve babies just like they're horrifying.

01:22:42.18
Rachel
And it's like the real fear like yeah, we're all scared of dying. We're all scared of the horrible things that come, but what we're really afraid of is all of our not even friends. But the people we know talking shit about us when we're not there like that's like the ultimate horror.

01:22:43.76
mikechumpchange
Um.

01:22:51.92
mikechumpchange
Oh yeah, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, that's a good point off.

01:22:58.52
Rachel
Like just everyone you know sitting there making jokes at your expense and you can't say anything.

01:23:02.93
mikechumpchange
Yeah, there's no reason to bring him there except that like hey I'm going to bring you here to get humiliated. There's no oh so sad. Yeah, um.

01:23:06.62
Rachel
Yeah, hey listen to though we're like all right? Yeah, truly.

01:23:09.13
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, he asks for it. He says show me family careful What you ask for? man.

01:23:19.29
mikechumpchange
Stephen you had a ah note here about ah 2 puppets we haven't talked about yet.

01:23:24.49
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah, so um, the as we've kind of mentioned but briefly before Rachel I think you you pointed this out. Um the role of Jacob Marley is split in this so that Statler and Waldorf can play Jacob and Robert Marley um

01:23:25.50
Rachel
Um, and.

01:23:39.53
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And I remember the first time I watched this being very confused like wait did I misread that book that I just read like was that was there a Robert in there the whole time and I missed it but like they create a whole because obviously if you're going to have someone taunting scrooge at the beginning and letting him know that there's going to be monsters coming to get him. Um. Statler and Waldorf for the obvious choice or Statler or Waldorf but they are kind of a team effort like what do we think about the choice to to split that role to cast Statler and Waldorf could they could they have cast just one of them should they have cast another muppet. What? How do we feel about that.

01:24:15.43
Rachel
I Don't think you can split them personally I don't think there's any way you can split those two up I Think like you said, if anyone's going to be mocking him. It's gonna be them. Um, so I can't think of another muppet that I would want to see in it like alternate Muppet Universe where it is the.

01:24:24.63
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:24:31.47
Rachel
You know someone's playing it funny I feel like you could have someone else do it but not in this version. It's got to be them. Um.

01:24:34.18
mikechumpchange
Now The only other thing I could see doing with them is making them the narrators like making them the charlo giving them the and gunzo role and I think that would be hysterical I could see them knocking that out of the park. But I think.

01:24:35.35
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right.

01:24:41.99
Rachel
Is.

01:24:42.94
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And.

01:24:47.91
Rachel
Yes.

01:24:50.14
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
That would be really funny.

01:24:53.10
mikechumpchange
You have to make them. They're such the obvious choice a because they're old and they would be dead you know because they're old I mean let's face it. They're just they're old and that's really the only point I have there is they're old um bus concludes my point. Thank you But they're the obvious.

01:24:58.12
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Never.

01:24:58.34
Rachel
Okay.

01:25:04.43
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, this concludes my discussion. Thank you.

01:25:05.54
Rachel
Um, yeah, this gold. Ah.

01:25:12.94
mikechumpchange
Point and also the way they're able to it's they're the first one to get under Scrooge's skin and you can see it. You can see him regress and it really works and it's to bannger of a song Marley and Marley is a great tune. Um, but you yeah you can see.

01:25:19.77
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, brain. Um.

01:25:22.55
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, it is.

01:25:28.24
Rachel
Horrifying to.

01:25:32.42
mikechumpchange
Both of them being the kind of like money-hung scrounging the type of people that would definitely put orphans out on the street on Christmas day and get a good laugh out of it like you can see them being the 2 muppets that would do that and they have one of the best jokes in the movie at Fozzy Wigs party

01:25:42.80
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right.

01:25:52.10
mikechumpchange
When they're like it was pointless. It was short. We loved it about poor fozzy wig speech like he gets no respect and he's their boss. That's what's great. It's not like when they're know you first Rachel.

01:25:57.12
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, they're right none at all. Yeah.

01:25:59.60
Rachel
None yeah I also think sorry I was just gonna say there's a fay part in Marley Marley when they're talking about the orphanage that they are laughing and they're joking. But even at the end of that they both shudder when they're talking about that mirror and it gives them that like.

01:26:15.31
mikechumpchange
Um, yep.

01:26:18.79
Rachel
Go like they is people or as Muppets would not. They don't give a fuck but anyone they're going to do anything but that like gives that we've seen some things now that we're dead and being tortured for the things we did. There's that little bit of humanity to it that I think also makes it horrifying for scrooge.

01:26:21.60
mikechumpchange
Yeah. Yeah I Don't think they shudder because they put orphans out they shudder because they're in chains. They don't care about the Orphan still and there's a part that like there's a couple things that are missing in this because you can't put everything in.

01:26:38.25
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, yeah.

01:26:40.28
Rachel
Ah, a okay.

01:26:46.35
mikechumpchange
But they talk in the novella when they when Marley Encounters scrooge he says like look you've been alive seven more years like your chains are much longer than mine because you've had seven more years to be a miserable prick but it doesn't say miserable prick because that's.

01:26:54.85
Rachel
Oh.

01:26:58.31
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah, right? That's not dickensian.

01:27:04.63
mikechumpchange
Not how Dickens right? Yeah, would not be but he's yeahp. Oh yeah, but might be but it's it's um, their interplay is great and they're wonderful. They're really, they're really really wonderful.

01:27:05.27
Rachel
That's our words and I wonder if so much of that is because I've never read it that that makes the difference that of the perception is because I only first knew it as 2 Marley's

01:27:16.69
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:27:21.71
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Oh yeah.

01:27:23.91
mikechumpchange
Um I don't see how you could break. The only thing I could see them doing is just if they were the narrators that would be it. There are new muppets in this and I do appreciate that they don't use muppets we recognize as the ghost of Christmas the the Christmas ghost.

01:27:31.60
Rachel
Alpha.

01:27:39.30
Rachel
Oh no.

01:27:43.79
mikechumpchange
I love the designs here that that ethereal design for the ghosts of Christmas past she was actually filmed in a water tank and then they would composite her into the shot afterwards in order to give her that look of like the floating robes I guess they tried it in oil. It didn't quite look is is so well. Um.

01:27:47.24
Rachel
E.

01:27:56.11
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And.

01:28:01.61
Rachel
Um, just a greasy past ghost.

01:28:02.85
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, to get a sugar. Yeah.

01:28:02.99
mikechumpchange
Yeah, just like the ghosts of crisco. Yeah, so what do we? How do we feel that these ghosts represent like what we think of when we think of this story as it's been represented in other mediums.

01:28:15.57
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I feel like this is the opportunity to combine kind of the Jim Henson company's roots with kind of where they were going right around the time Jim Died because all of these puppets with the exception of the ghost of Christmas present who is my favorite.

01:28:23.10
mikechumpchange
Groove.

01:28:33.60
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, because Jerry Nelson is just a fucking delight as the ghost of Christmas present. Um, and that's more kind of in the style of like a sweums or a junior gorg or something. Um, but the other two are very much in line with something you might see on the storyteller. Um or in like ah like a dark tower riff or something like you've got. Um.

01:28:34.30
mikechumpchange
Who.

01:28:46.75
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah.

01:28:52.45
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Just the way that that puppet those puppets are are modeled in designs and it reminds you that I don't know I think it grounds it a little more because you're not, You're not in the I don't know yeah it it. It kind of grounds it a little more because these aren't the the characters you recognize.

01:29:10.46
mikechumpchange
Of who.

01:29:12.36
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
you're you're more you're more immersed in the actual story itself as a result um like I remember the mickey Christmas Carol you have I think Jimmony Christmas is the ghost of Christmas pass and um, the giant from me. Ah. Jack Mickey and the bean stock is is the ghost of Christmas present and then Pete is the ghost of christmas yet to come. It's okay, well we're slotting in these kind of lesser characters and so rather than doing that we're creating these brand new characters I think if it had been a parody. Yeah, you'd want to see your muppet friends in there but because we're playing this straight.

01:29:46.80
mikechumpchange
Down.

01:29:46.36
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And the designs are so cool like it's very evocative of what you would imagine reading the book that these characters might end up looking like.

01:29:54.19
Rachel
And it's I feel like it may it pairs really well with other versions of the Christmas Carol specifically like the George C Scott one I feel like they beautifully took a classic image from Dickens story and made it their own. But also I think. The fact that it's not the muppets we know does give it even more that like the world that exists is the Muppet world that George C Scott are no sorry that Michael Kaine is in and that Kermit is in and these ghosts are from a different world. The muppets can tell the humans can tell they are muppets but not from our Muppet world.

01:30:22.50
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
No.

01:30:29.46
Rachel
Which gives it even more of a clear otherworldly eerie vibe because they aren't ones we recognize.

01:30:34.53
mikechumpchange
Yeah I agree and I I agree with both of you that is a much different aesthetic from the rest of the muppets. It is like they do have a more kind of carved out almost wooden look especially on the ghost of Christmas past.

01:30:48.47
Rachel
Oh.

01:30:53.19
mikechumpchange
It almost looks like ah a China doll like a lot you would see like a carved a porcelain doll I think would be a better way to put that sorry um, something very fragile. Um, the ghost of Christmas present I think is maybe the highlight for most people just like really yes yeah yeah.

01:30:55.74
Rachel
Meaning.

01:30:56.32
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, right.

01:31:01.23
Rachel
Yes.

01:31:07.57
Rachel
And the muppiest you know like.

01:31:09.20
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yes, yes.

01:31:12.91
mikechumpchange
But we all what we all kind of like want to kind of like attain like that kind of spirit and that's real joy but we see them age as well. They don't shy away from that here. Um I noticed like watching this again. The ghost of Christmas yet to come.

01:31:15.98
Rachel
1

01:31:22.20
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
So.

01:31:31.92
mikechumpchange
It's not pure black. It doesn't look like a dementor or one of the creatures from ah Lord of the rings which I think is what it's kind of well modeled after many times ah in the movies but it looks more like his bedsheets. It looks more like what he would find and I think that's a really nice visual.

01:31:45.95
Rachel
Here.

01:31:51.63
mikechumpchange
Touch Still pretty scary, but it's still. It's kind of like yeah um, yeah, um.

01:31:54.51
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
It's the arms. The arms are like unnaturally long like almost twice as long as normal human arms would be like they're almost dragging the ground but not quite like when he's when he's walking his hands are normally folded. But I think there's a couple scenes where there are down at his side and you can tell.

01:32:02.60
Rachel
Yes.

01:32:07.90
Rachel
It hit.

01:32:10.16
mikechumpchange
Group.

01:32:10.74
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
They're hanging very low and so like that's the prominent feet and that's what makes it I think so unnerving the design on it is because those arms are so prominent and those hands are so large and again very detail like a lot of as you would expect from the Muppets like a lot of attention to detail there. It's.

01:32:15.41
mikechumpchange
Now.

01:32:21.97
mikechumpchange
Group now have.

01:32:29.00
Rachel
And he interacts with Scrooge a lot with it I feel like of them uppp. You know he is touching him with those big hands. He's guiding him. There's this connection that when you watch that human and that puppet interact. It's a very different vibe than he's interacting with the other puppets.

01:32:29.27
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Absolutely incredible.

01:32:36.64
mikechumpchange
Vu.

01:32:42.22
mikechumpchange
Who.

01:32:43.64
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And you can tell that's not a natural human like that's it's much larger. It's the proportion differently. It doesn't move like a regular human yeah like so you can tell there's there's something deeply sinister here for sure. Oh.

01:32:47.75
Rachel
Yeah, the proportion the hence huge.

01:33:01.47
Rachel
Scared the shit out of me when I was a kid man.

01:33:01.68
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah, just for a giggle because I'm good on time. How are both of you doing on time. Good Okay, just want to make sure I know we have a bunch here and I don't want to bogart. Everyone's time. So.

01:33:03.58
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Rightly. So.

01:33:09.83
Rachel
I'm good.

01:33:13.99
Rachel
Feeling good things. Yeah hours like.

01:33:16.16
mikechumpchange
Um, but I'm good too. Um, over okay, not a problem. Okay, um, tying into that like the overall like aesthetic of this movie and the way like this world world of London is represented I think is so gorgeous like just that.

01:33:18.57
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
We're talking about the Muppets How many opportunities you think I get to talk muppets.

01:33:35.16
mikechumpchange
Opening shot and I think that you know that Henson talked about like yeah we made some mistakes the way it's designed that there are some things like if you rewatch it you can pick up on that like don't look right or that like aren't supposed to be there but like we were a we thought like you wouldn't be able to catch them on like a quick watch. But I think this is like a visually striking movie and I think when the muppets like we talk about the muppet show when the muppets are at their best like it's a very chaotic world. Things are constantly in motion. It looks like a very lived in world and I think that the street it looks like a very.

01:34:05.50
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, me.

01:34:11.55
mikechumpchange
Lived in world here that there's always things in motion people are always moving about Muppets are always moving about and I just love the aesthetic and the design and the set pieces here I think it's just so well representped and. In such a visually striking and beautiful movie.

01:34:30.52
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
It reminds me kind of of ah of a Disney ride like a pirates of the caribbean kind of thing where like there are so many details that you can't possibly catch them all your first ride through you have to go on the ride over and over and over again to be able to catch all the little funny moments and details that are kind of peppered in the background.

01:34:32.17
mikechumpchange
Zoom.

01:34:32.89
Rachel
Is not.

01:34:37.37
mikechumpchange
Down who.

01:34:47.43
Rachel
And it just feels like england at Christmas time my sister lives ah in London or ah, they just moved to Oxford but she lived in London and I was there visiting her and I was like oh my god am I in the mupp at Christmas Carol just like the cobblestone streets in the old side of the buildings you're like oh my god it's so.

01:34:55.46
mikechumpchange
Oh wow.

01:35:03.68
mikechumpchange
Yeah, the the UK is my wife is from Cornwall and we've entered the UKA few times at Christmas and it it feels amazing. It's definitely yes, like people go to the pub on Christmas day like you open your presence.

01:35:03.74
Rachel
It just feels like London and ah love it. Oh okay, cool. It's magical. You feel like you've gone back in time somehow.

01:35:04.41
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Pride on.

01:35:23.54
mikechumpchange
And then you're like she lives in a village where like 75 people live there year-round. It's right on the beach. She actually lives like a 20 minutes from the ah light tower of fragel rock is so we've gone there. Um in like about 20 minutes from the um.

01:35:23.80
Rachel
Yep.

01:35:28.50
Rachel
If yes.

01:35:35.60
Rachel
Oh my god.

01:35:41.62
mikechumpchange
Ah, the hell hounds from the omen. So I've climbed like that structure I've got like photos of me up there but you go to the pub at like noon on Christmas and everybody like toasts one another then you go in like have your Christmas dinner. It just hits different. It's so amazing.

01:35:44.20
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Oh my god.

01:35:44.60
Rachel
Um, oh that's pretty good.

01:35:55.84
Rachel
And it's the same kind of food. They I feel like they bring in other than the singing grapes like a very British kind of meal to it like it. It involves. Yeah yeah.

01:36:02.79
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah, it's you got to know where to go to get the singing grapes like you have to have a connection I Guess we so lovely. Um.

01:36:09.53
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Look just so long as I can keep off the moors I am going to be fine.

01:36:17.98
mikechumpchange
But I definitely love a UK christmas so I have not been to London yet so that's from this year oh

01:36:20.25
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
God I'm so jealous of you guys I've never even been to the u k let alone on christmas.

01:36:20.46
Rachel
Ah, it's magic.

01:36:25.40
Rachel
Sounds like you guys need to do like a movie tour there you got some okay I'll work on that like.

01:36:29.90
mikechumpchange
Think we need a lot more patrons and they need to kick in and we can do a field trip. Um, what about that I think do your thing folks all right.

01:36:32.64
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, and then.

01:36:35.46
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Come on patrons. Do your thing.

01:36:37.22
Rachel
Yeah, come on people.

01:36:42.32
mikechumpchange
Part of the reason this movie works so well is the the music I think and I'm usually not a fan of musicals I think Paul Williams work here is just incredible like it's a great comeback for him. What are some of our favorites like what are the tunes that really.

01:36:46.60
Rachel
Um, same oh impactable.

01:36:47.19
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Oh I Love him? yeah.

01:36:59.52
mikechumpchange
Stand out and I think Rachel you've got one like right off the top which you think it's a banger. Mmm.

01:37:02.86
Rachel
Oh yeah, I'm a Marley and Marley girl. It's so good. It's so dramatic I've always like a spooky villain song in the Disney movies I'm like I always like the like kind of minor key bad songs. Um, and even as like a unexposed to horror little baby like my heart. Loved.

01:37:10.61
mikechumpchange
Um lu.

01:37:20.13
Rachel
Something scary and so that I'm just like yes, but truly all of them I listen to soundtrack every single song and there's a banger. There's not one that I would get rid of as obvious by my passion for the love is gone. But I think yeah and I hate a musical I never watch a musical I'm just like stop singing and dancing but in this.

01:37:21.32
mikechumpchange
Vu.

01:37:37.22
mikechumpchange
You have same I can't stand musicals.

01:37:38.90
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, oh oh you guys are killing the inner musical theater geek in me. Um, oh no, it's part probably being. It's probably the theater kid in me I Just I'd love a good musical I love.

01:37:39.99
Rachel
Love it. Ya can't stop the work. Oh oh.

01:37:52.98
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
All singing all dancing. Yes, please my favorite episode of Buffy is once more with feeling. Um I can't I can't help myself like I love a good musical. Um, my partner and I went and saw a book of mormon when it was here in Chicago last year like in March like it.

01:37:58.86
Rachel
Ah.

01:37:59.42
mikechumpchange
It's a great episode.

01:38:09.91
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I Love a good musical So sign me up.

01:38:11.49
Rachel
I will say musical theater versus a musical movie or a different vibe because I do like to see live I feel like a live musical. There's that energy a movie musical sometimes other than Muppets because I do like the muppet ones. Um.

01:38:13.66
mikechumpchange
Well.

01:38:22.10
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah.

01:38:24.77
Rachel
It just doesn't translate to me when there's not the like stage. Okay, yeah.

01:38:26.58
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I mean in the heights was one of my favorite movies a couple years ago when that came out like 1 of my favorite movies of the year like I I'm a sucker for a good musical west side story bused story is I think Spielberg version is perfect like 10 to to 10 no notes like.

01:38:28.38
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah.

01:38:35.18
Rachel
Love the music.

01:38:37.43
mikechumpchange
Um.

01:38:42.30
Rachel
Okay, never saw me.

01:38:42.84
mikechumpchange
Like so I love me like Anna and the apocalypse like I do love I do love that movie like I can do the occasional musical. But in general I think there's a reason why a lot of these films that are coming out that are musical is like it's being hidden.

01:38:44.94
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I Love a good musical always have.

01:39:00.76
Rachel
And.

01:39:02.53
mikechumpchange
You know I think there's a reason why like you're like we're not really advertising that here in any of the trailers. Yes.

01:39:07.23
Rachel
Please still come see our movie.

01:39:08.83
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Now I I want you to let me know and the chances are good I'm probably going to be there earlier if you tell me it's actually musical um to answer your question though. Mike um, it feels like Christmas is my number one with a bullet i.

01:39:15.71
mikechumpchange
Um, okay, click.

01:39:20.14
mikechumpchange
Oh.

01:39:24.54
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Again, Jerry Jules Ghost of Christmas present is such a fucking delight. Maybe my favorite character in this movie. Um, and when the orchestra like swells going into the chorus and do is I just I tear up every time like I can't help it it just it makes me. It reminds me of like what Christmas was like when I was a kid.

01:39:25.35
Rachel
And.

01:39:35.83
mikechumpchange
M.

01:39:43.59
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, in musical like distilled into song form I'm starting to get a little misty just talking about it like I I love it so much. It's such a great number and I'm a I'm a sucker for a big show stopper and that's that's kind of this movie's version of a big show stopper.

01:39:46.79
Rachel
No.

01:39:47.10
mikechumpchange
Now.

01:39:57.77
mikechumpchange
Oh yeah, yeah.

01:39:59.10
Rachel
No, and then.

01:40:00.62
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Ah, like with the dancing in the streets and and like it's it's a show stopper and I really love that about it. So yeah, it's it's got to be it feels like Christmas for me.

01:40:07.56
mikechumpchange
Um, so I've got a pair here I love scrooge I love the one that opens up after the overture and miles good like Paul Williams like wrote the music for this like the melodies and like the songs we sing but miles goodman.

01:40:13.26
Rachel
M.

01:40:14.99
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Listen.

01:40:24.95
mikechumpchange
Compose the score he does the overture ah but like Scrooge from Williams I think is great. It opens it like it sets up what you're going to see so well I love like the chorus for it. I'm a fan of the melody and you can like make it dirty really easy. It's like you know. There goes Mr. Asshole there goes Mr bitch. It's just fucking great. You can definitely do things like that. But it's just ah, it sets up the character so well and it's a really fun song I also I love thankful heart I love the melody to that song.

01:40:48.64
Rachel
Her.

01:40:57.48
Rachel
Who is.

01:41:00.85
mikechumpchange
Ah, like Kane is not a good so he's not really a great sing. He's not a poor singer but he just puts himself into the song I love the the ideas behind that song. Um I think it's a really jaunty tune I just love how it like plays out where everyone's following him. They're kind of like what are all these shops that are open on christmas.

01:41:11.71
Rachel
A.

01:41:19.19
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
1 of them is called Statler and Waldorf I don't know if you caught that one. Yeah, there's one called Statler and Waldorf.

01:41:20.47
mikechumpchange
Um, oh I miss that I Absolutely I did miss that. Um, but I think it like represents like the sentiment of this story in this movie and what this holiday is all about, um.

01:41:23.63
Rachel
Um, yeah.

01:41:38.48
mikechumpchange
Really well and I think that the way cain sings it and like the heart that he puts into it is more important than any particular like having like a well trained voice and it's probably my favorite. Song in this whole movie I could listen to that on its own I Really love that song a lot who yeah.

01:41:59.13
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah, he really does go for it too like he just he throws himself into it like like yeah I'm not a good singer but deal with it because Scrooge is inspired to to sing right now and it it. It sells for sure and but I agree with you rich I don't think there's a bad song in this movie I really don't.

01:42:06.93
mikechumpchange
No, no yeah.

01:42:07.68
Rachel
Admit.

01:42:14.35
Rachel
I Want them all and.

01:42:17.43
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Time.

01:42:18.34
mikechumpchange
And again Williams just um, ah Frank Oz talked about the music in this movie and he talked about why it really connects with people. Um, and Frank Oz said it's his simplicity in his heart and purity. That's where it comes from for Jim. It's the purity of intent the purity of character not being afraid of sweetness not pejorative sweetness but real actual valuable sweetness Jim was that and Paul is too. They're able to be sweet without being saccharin and I think that's really important like is we mentioned Disney earlier and I'm not a huge Disney person I think a lot of times like their movies are a little too cutesy and like you mentioned the Disney Christmas Carol like I just never watch them because I just.

01:42:51.31
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And.

01:43:09.28
mikechumpchange
Just not for me. They wipe out a lot of the darkness of their stories in order to make it like palpable for children where yeah this we'll talk about that in a moment like this story goes to a lot of dark places and it's not afraid.

01:43:16.84
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
They sugarcoat a lot. Yeah.

01:43:26.22
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:43:27.31
mikechumpchange
To show children dark things it will hold your hand and it will guide you through them and it will make sure that it's not too scary like someone will be there to support you. But it's never saccharine Jim hated being cute and hated being saccharinein. That's Frank Oz he hated faux sentimentality.

01:43:42.98
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
So.

01:43:45.36
mikechumpchange
What we got from Paul was exactly the reverse of that and exactly what Jim wanted he and Jim somehow connected they just did I don't know how many times he worked with Paul but every time it always felt like he was part of the family and I think that like Paul Williams is very much like the. 1 of the axes in the hole for the best muppets work I think that's why this movie is so good like and I think part of why the Muppet movie is so good like you think of that movie and a rainbow connection and moving light along and can you picture that like.

01:44:08.40
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah.

01:44:17.92
mikechumpchange
Williams just wrote like bang or after bang or after banger. No no who yeah um, so.

01:44:18.37
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I was going to say that's another movie where there's not a bad song in that even the melancholy one I'm going to go back there someday like just ripped your heart out like it's so melancholy and so beautiful like I adore every song in that movie for sure.

01:44:20.51
Rachel
Yeah, yeah.

01:44:31.96
Rachel
Yes.

01:44:36.32
mikechumpchange
Let's talk about some of the darkness of this movie. Let's do that I feel like the what do we feel is the what scene do we feel is like the emotional linchpin of this movie for me. It feels like it's the scene at the cratchit household.

01:44:40.17
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Let's.

01:44:51.65
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:44:55.78
mikechumpchange
Because it feels like it's the first scene where like Scrooge has started to defrost a bit after his encounter with the ghost of Christmas past but he's reflecting on his own life and his own flaws but things that have been done to him. For me, it's when he sees the cratchits and how they're living and he's like the feast is so small. It's the first time that he has to reflect on like how little other people have versus how much he has access to. And to me it feels like the heart of like why this story works. What are your thoughts.

01:45:37.88
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I would say not I would say not just that Mike not just how little other people have but how little other people have by direct extension of his own action like he has a direct responsibility for how much Bob Cratchett makes um and.

01:45:46.31
mikechumpchange
Approve.

01:45:55.79
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
1 of the things that I like about the entire section with the ghost of Christmas present is that scrooge really gets a sense of how other people see him like for the first one. It's it's all from his perspective like the ghost script was passed. It's all from his perspective things that have happened to him his dad dumping him at a boarding school. Um, you know, working through Christmas getting dumped by his girlfriend like that's all things that are that's all from his perspective. But for the first time he gets to see how the other how how everyone else lives and how everyone else views him from his own family to his employees like he gets to see the basically he gets to see. Born out in front of him what the Marleys warned him about early on like he gets to see oh these things are happening these people hate me these people have so little as a direct result of how I've been living my life and how I have been treating them and so this is this is what I have wrought upon this world. Um. And I think I know based on based on that I think you've got a real point there but he also so connects in a very surprising way with tiny Tim um, like he really connects with Tim cratchit and really sort of emotionally bonds.

01:47:04.50
mikechumpchange
Yeah.

01:47:13.72
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
With that character in a way that we've not seen him connect with literally anyone else for the entire run of the movie or the entirety of the story and I'm not sure what it is whether it's Tim's attitude in spite of what's what his physical condition is. If. It's just because of the physical condition. The physical condition combined with the poverty maybe his ability to keep a positive outlook through all of that I'm not sure what it is that draws cratchit to or draws scrooge to him rather but I feel like that is one of the stronger emotional connections. In the film and the fact that we care about this little child who gets maybe three and a half five minutes of screen time in the whole film is is really just remarkable storytelling if nothing else.

01:48:00.79
mikechumpchange
Move.

01:48:04.15
Rachel
Yes I think the fact that they choose to leave in the line where they bring back? Ah well if he's going to die then he should go ahead and do it and decrease the Surplus population I feel like that's such a heavy hitter in all of the dickens movies. But the the balance to it being the goofiest muppetiest ghost that you.

01:48:15.60
mikechumpchange
Who.

01:48:22.77
Rachel
Love and he and scrooge is connecting with to bring back that line is so like dark and impactful. Um that I think that's one of the grimmest and then you brought it up in the notes. The scene where you see the little bunny shivering in his newspaper at the end like that wrecks me every time because you usually.

01:48:27.99
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
In.

01:48:35.14
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah, yeah.

01:48:42.33
Rachel
Bad things happen to muppets but you know it's going to be okay and that's just such a bleak real moment with him and it it is it tears your heart apart which is 1 thing that I will say I do love about this movie is that most of the terrible things that you see happen to the muppets come back around. He gets his.

01:48:43.26
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Now.

01:48:51.27
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah.

01:48:59.30
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah.

01:49:00.86
Rachel
Good ending. So to the little mice and I that's why they am like I feel like they show us horrible things and then they give us a little glimmer of hope which is pretty much what the story's about. So.

01:49:06.27
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah, and that's what it's all about and I I agree with everything that was just said there and I think that the fact that scrooge for the first time sees what happens like this and you see with the the. Fast forward or the Christmas forward scrooge is less concerned about what happens to him in the future but more like well what happened to tiny tim and when he sees that empty stool and you see like Kermit and Miss Piggy or Bob and his wife.

01:49:31.93
Rachel
Anything.

01:49:41.36
mikechumpchange
And how sad everyone is he is like Tim is no longer there like it's a really impactful moment and I think that is like the moment that really changes things for scrooge more than anything else. Yeah.

01:49:50.48
Rachel
And those puppets emot the hell out of it like I've never seen a grieving muppet like do that I'm like how does a tiny little Pig rip my heart out but every time they're so it's so sad you're like oh my God I cry every time.

01:49:58.78
mikechumpchange
Ri from group.

01:49:59.40
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Like that just like that there are I don't know if this is the right time to bring this up but there are I I stumbled on some outtakes from the movie today and 1 of them is from that scene in the in the Christmas yet to come.

01:50:13.16
mikechumpchange
Um.

01:50:18.43
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And ah, they're all kind of mourning the loss of tiny tim and then one of the daughters I don't remember which 1 pops her head up and go can I have his dinner and I I lost it I completely lost my shit. It was so funny.

01:50:27.97
mikechumpchange
Ah, that works. Oh and I'll admit like I because I've seen this enough where I crack jokes during the tiny Tim bits and that's just also the way I'm built you know I am not always the most sensitive person despite.

01:50:33.87
Rachel
Ah, oh.

01:50:35.16
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Sure right.

01:50:45.71
mikechumpchange
Working as a therapist. Um, where like when tiny tim is like hacking up a lung at the dinner table I'm like well I guess those chestnuts are yours now like thanks a lot for coughing all over the Christmas dinner or when yeah.

01:50:48.60
Rachel
Ah, yes.

01:50:57.70
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, oh great I Just dip theory just the seasoning I needed.

01:51:03.70
mikechumpchange
You know when like they all sit around the table and like in he starts singing. It's like would you shut the fuck up. We want to eat you know, like stop bursting into song. It's dinner time you know? Um, yeah, you know time for turkey. Um.

01:51:03.75
Rachel
Ah.

01:51:15.93
Rachel
Bet You wouldn't have bad lungs If you'd stop singing for a minute. Ah.

01:51:16.19
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right.

01:51:22.71
mikechumpchange
But I I feel like that is like the real linchpin here and it's like when Scrooge really starts to melt and you're right like that. The bunny scene is the other one that gets me like when he's just shivering away in cold more than you know? So yeah. Here's my other thing is Scrooge's angst around Christmas somewhat justified because I feel like he's having a trauma response. It's centered around Christmas when you look at his backstory as a whole his father like dumped him at a boarding school.

01:51:55.46
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:51:58.32
mikechumpchange
And just left him there for years and he was sort of forced to suffer these countless holidays alone and one of the things that this movie leaves out is his sister coming to the school and saying Dad's had to change a heart. You can now come home.

01:52:12.87
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right.

01:52:15.77
mikechumpchange
That's left out here. He just like all right now you've been apprenticed off to like fozzi wig so he never goes home his one love the one woman he's ever been in love with leaves him on Christmas Eve she's like

01:52:19.90
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
A.

01:52:31.15
mikechumpchange
Ah, this isn't working anymore. All you do is work which is a reasonable reason to leave someone but I can also see his point of view is like I'm trying to build a life for us. You know we don't have a lot yet I want to secure our future but he's gone too far in that direction. He's so hated. People burst into song about how much they hate him when he's just on its way to work like that's a level of hatred that I could only aspire to like if kids you know? Um, if I remember correctly like Marley dies on Christmas in the novella.

01:52:52.88
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, right.

01:52:59.83
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:53:06.72
Rachel
Oh.

01:53:08.40
mikechumpchange
And that's like the closest thing that he has to a friend. Um, so also if I remember correctly the reason why Scrooge is cold to his nephew Fred is and this is not in this movie at all is his sister died giving birth to Fred.

01:53:09.13
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Bright.

01:53:24.60
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right.

01:53:26.16
mikechumpchange
And he loved his sister very much so all of this like it kind of explains why Scrooge is the way he is like he's a man who's in tremendous pain at a time when there's really not a thing called therapy or prozac or anything that might.

01:53:43.44
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And I think in a lot of ways. That's the reality for a lot of people around the holidays too like not everyone associates the holidays with good memories. Um, you know sometimes really shitty things happen very close to this. Ah apparently very joyous time of the year and there's nothing that feels more lonely than being the only person that.

01:53:43.69
mikechumpchange
Help this man out who.

01:53:47.83
Rachel
Yes, yes.

01:54:03.30
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Doesn't seem to be getting into the spirit. Um, so like he is. He's isolated himself and I think his attitude toward Christmas while justified does not justify his treatment of everyone else around him and I think that's really what it comes down to.

01:54:18.14
mikechumpchange
Who.

01:54:22.17
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Like is his attitude toward Christmas justified absolutely that is a man who has had some terrible shit happen to him but by the same token that doesn't mean that you get to treat everyone that you come across like a piece of garbage like you need to you need to find find that balance.

01:54:38.29
Rachel
Yeah, um, yeah and I think even if you haven't had terrible things happen to you at Christmas which a lot of people have and it's not a happy time for them. We have this idea that it has to be fun. There's so much pressure that Christmas has to be everything.

01:54:40.15
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Which by the end of the movie mercifully he does. But yeah.

01:54:52.94
mikechumpchange
Vu.

01:54:55.64
Rachel
That in turn I think a lot of us end up feeling like fuck this whole holiday like if I have to drive by the mall one more time I'm going to lose my shit and like so I think there is that aspect that we all kind of see where Scrooge is from not the rich part of it by any means. But the what the hell are we doing on this holiday.

01:55:01.93
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah.

01:55:13.36
Rachel
And I'm like so we relate to him in that way.

01:55:14.12
mikechumpchange
Now it's why I like Thanksgiving more than Christmas is because you get a lot of the good parts of Christmas without a lot of the craziness like it's just really like I'm going to cook a really big meal I'm going to get together with friends and family. We're going to eat a really big meal.

01:55:14.30
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Down.

01:55:18.53
Rachel
A.

01:55:26.40
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
No.

01:55:33.29
mikechumpchange
And then we're going to unbuckle our pants and watch movies or football and I'm not going to worry about presents I'm not going to worry about going shopping I'm not going to worry about all the material things we're just going to eat a giant ass turkey and I am going to cram as many mashed potatoes down my gullet as I possibly can.

01:55:37.16
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

01:55:52.33
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
In accordance with scripture.

01:55:52.35
mikechumpchange
To the point where it's dangerous without all the trappings I love Thanksgiving christmas is hard.

01:55:54.19
Rachel
Yes, and Christmas is hard and Christmas isn't a day Thanksgiving is just one day albeit like there is some input and you know some genocide but Christmas is a month and a half of nonstop.

01:56:02.79
mikechumpchange
Who.

01:56:09.21
mikechumpchange
Oh.

01:56:11.25
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yep.

01:56:12.88
Rachel
And so you don't have a chance to be a scrooge because you have to go to every dinner you have to go to every thing along you have to go to every event with a smile on your face and a $25 gift card and like who doesn't feel screwy after that like 1 thing.

01:56:21.42
mikechumpchange
Yeah, um, the um.

01:56:23.40
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah, absolutely.

01:56:29.31
Rachel
That I always think is weird is how much as a society we vilify Scrooge and we hate him and he's this terrible person. We all get it when we watch this but then we can't just stop loving a billionaire I'm like we can't draw the comparison. That's what it always drives me crazy people are like don't be a scrooge I'm like I think.

01:56:31.96
mikechumpchange
Who.

01:56:38.32
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And.

01:56:41.38
mikechumpchange
Um.

01:56:47.53
Rachel
Missing the point. Maybe once again, watch the 92 Muppet Christmas Carol classic and see if you can pick up some pointers on how it applies to our real world.

01:56:54.51
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I Well I mean we as a society are completely media literate at this point and we do not understand Irony Subtlety or nuance. So.

01:56:56.87
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah pop.

01:57:02.72
Rachel
So fun isn't it.

01:57:04.32
mikechumpchange
That's why I I completely agree and 1 of the things that I find fascinating and one of the things that keeps me up at night if this move if this story was published now in 2023 in the year of our lord if there would be.

01:57:19.26
Rachel
And.

01:57:21.25
mikechumpchange
Any resonance with modern audiences because I feel like what would happen because this is a really explicit critique of unchecked Free Market Capitalism. It's telling you like this is bad like what we are doing is bad the way we are working people to the bone and underpaying them.

01:57:29.24
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, absolutely.

01:57:40.28
mikechumpchange
This is not good and it's unsustainable and we should not doing. We should be paying people a fair wage We should be giving people time off ample time off, we should be less concerned with working and more concerned with spending time with friends and family and loved ones. Um.

01:58:00.70
mikechumpchange
There's a line in thankful heart where it's like the true measure of a man's heart is how many friends that he has at the end don't measure a person by how much money he has. It's by the measure of his friends and I really believe that I look at like.

01:58:10.38
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
You have.

01:58:15.11
mikechumpchange
The end of the day like that's how you measure a person like who do you who looks up to you who are the people you call friends and and I've been very fortunate to say that like I I look at the people I've surrounded myself with and I'm like I got really melancholy at one point I was talking with my sister. Some we were at some like punk show it was a punk flea market and her husband was playing for the first time in forever because he's a phenomenal musician and he got to like get together with friends and play in a band again and we're there and we brought our kids who are like 13 and hers are like. 6 and four and we're in our 40 s and the kids running it are in their twenty s and it's a much different scene and and I'm like it's in a good place and I'm like we've had a good run like what a great fucking life. We've had I'm like if it ended tomorrow. We had a good run. She's like what the fuck are you talking about like shut up. So. Sorry um, got a little little little deep there. Um, if this story came out today I feel like Fox News would whip its viewers into a frenzy and be like this is too woke like this is communist propaganda and we talked about this last year when we did. It's a wonderful life like.

01:59:28.71
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
White.

01:59:31.41
mikechumpchange
Frank kaper and Jimmy Stewart were put on an Fbi watch list after it's a wonderful life came out because like this is like call me speak right here. What are they doing and I feel like that would happen with it's a Christmas carol because the Ceo of wayfare came out this week and said.

01:59:33.80
Rachel
Oh.

01:59:40.90
Rachel
Um, totally.

01:59:48.60
mikechumpchange
To his employees like ah, an email surface that said you people should be your our employees should be thinking about tying their work into their home life more that it's not a 9 to 5 gig you should be thinking about work more when you're off the clock and it's such a fucked up way to think about life.

02:00:05.27
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, nope yeah I hate everything about that I mean I I'm wrong you you say that Mike and and this story has been so prevalent for so long and yet people miss it. But these are also the people that.

02:00:06.93
Rachel
Nope Nope. Nope. Nope.

02:00:08.60
mikechumpchange
No yeah.

02:00:20.37
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Are getting online and saying like oh when did when did star wars and star trek become political like they've they've always been political like what are you? What are you talking like this the Christmas Carol has always been political. This is not anything new. You've just been completely missing the point.

02:00:25.80
Rachel
Who.

02:00:26.75
mikechumpchange
Um, John.

02:00:39.53
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
For the last x amount of years like that's that's on you buddy like you for almost 200 years you've been missing the point of of Charles Dickens as a Christmas carol that don't put that on me that's on you and thank you for posting your ls so loudly. But again like I I feel like.

02:00:41.96
mikechumpchange
Down.

02:00:49.92
mikechumpchange
No.

02:00:56.39
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
when I when I read shit like that I'm just like is media literacy really dead and I have to believe on some level kind of because you know the the whole notion that the whole point of this thing is yeah capitalism bad um, pay people fairly um, do not. Wait for one time of the year to be nice and kind to people like food banks go nuts around Christmas time and then spend the rest of the year begging everyone for donations because the only time people want to be charitable or generous is around the holidays and so like it's.

02:01:21.84
mikechumpchange
Who know.

02:01:26.13
Rachel
1

02:01:31.74
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
It's that that great kind of unchecked I Guess um metric like that that that thing that we just don't think about very often is the fact that yeah this is this is always a problem and we've allowed it to get to this point and.

02:01:44.28
mikechumpchange
Um.

02:01:46.42
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
But are we going to do about it. Well we're going to complain about it online. That's what we're going to do right.

02:01:48.51
Rachel
Always It's the most effective way to get anything done bitch about it.

02:01:51.74
mikechumpchange
You know I mean we're I'm looking at states in 2023 that rolled back child labor laws like literally past legislation to roll back saying it's okay for fourteen year olds to work more hours after school.

02:02:03.51
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
This is.

02:02:09.49
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
No.

02:02:11.66
mikechumpchange
And their rationale is like well families have it tough right now. So the solution is to not make it so that persons have to earn a more fair wage. It's not to improve working conditions. It's not to support labor unions. It is like let's make it so the persons that are most vulnerable. Who have the least amount of skin in the game game who can't really affect any change at alls or too young to vote you too young to really take any part in a system that can affect change. Let's make it so they can work more hours. Um and work harder jobs like that is what we want to go back to and. That is to me a very It's a very scary thing and I feel like in an individual level. People are inherently good like as individuals people are good I really do believe that in my heart and I've said that elsewhere. So that when we talked about godzilla on the patron page politics aside when you put politics into it. It's when we become our worst selves 1 side more than the other but there are bad faith actors in both sides at one side much worse than the other.

02:03:27.35
mikechumpchange
Individually I think people want to do good but we just introduce a lot of muckymuck into it and people get tied into like a certain set of core economic beliefs that like especially here we think that if I just work really really hard I can become a millionaire or a billionaire too one day. It's like no man. If you work really really Hard. You're going to make your boss a lot of money and you're just going to work yourself to the grave earlier. So I don't know that's my thought.

02:03:46.86
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, correct yep Ah, but as long as the billionaires can keep buying off politicians. Nothing's ever going to change.

02:03:59.58
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah, all right. Do we want to end on that note so so kept.

02:04:03.45
Rachel
And yeah, who.

02:04:05.89
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yay positivity well two things I want to say real quick mike 1 to stave off all the people that are going to tweet at me. Um, you do have to go into the extras on Disney plus to get the full version but it is there i.

02:04:16.84
mikechumpchange
Move.

02:04:17.18
Rachel
Okay I know I don't know that either okay help reward. Um, he is a durable.

02:04:19.58
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Had I but known that I did not know but it is there. Well now we know now everyone knows and second of all the bunny. The bunny has a name and his name is bean bunny and he is adorable and I love him and he is voiced by Steve whitmeier. He was a late late eighty s creation of Steve Witmeyers and um.

02:04:23.43
mikechumpchange
Now.

02:04:29.15
mikechumpchange
Yeah.

02:04:39.21
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
He kind of got phased out I think shortly after this movie I think people found him a little too cloying. But um, yeah, he's a great character.

02:04:39.80
mikechumpchange
I know. Thought they'd be like yeah Michael Ka you know what to go great with that turkey rabbit and then he just chases down poor miss piggy has to cook for all of those people that Scrooge invites.

02:04:44.88
Rachel
The best.

02:04:52.26
Rachel
Um.

02:04:53.10
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Sharpens his knife.

02:04:58.23
Rachel
That is my thought every time I'm like the entire town just hop skipped and jumped their way to your table with a raw as turkey like 4 hours before the meal you're like hey I'm really nice now now cook for me and everyone who lives here I'm like real Miss Piggy would have had a.

02:05:06.91
mikechumpchange
Um, it's like now now. Yeah like Ebb Ebenezer you better, be rolling up those sleeves and like cutting some potatoes and.

02:05:08.45
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah.

02:05:15.69
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Correct.

02:05:17.22
Rachel
Meltdown but yeah and bring in a cooked turkey. Get a rotisserie chicken I don't know what they had back then but don't you be bringing a bird that is raw to my house 2 hours before a meal fruit.

02:05:24.11
mikechumpchange
Roasting some carrots too. Yeah, yeah, absolutely not.

02:05:30.50
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
At least it's already been thawed So a lot of the like the the prep work has already been done. It's genome. It's just the seasoning and the roasting that that needs to be done. It is.

02:05:36.56
Rachel
Yeah, yeah, it comes out nice at the end. That's a nice brown turkey like an old Muppet turkey.

02:05:37.60
mikechumpchange
Um, ah, but also yeah, that is it it. It's probably like it's 15 minutes per pound of turkey and that's probably like a £30 bird

02:05:48.69
Rachel
Okay.

02:05:50.76
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

02:05:53.26
mikechumpchange
So you're looking at like 6 to 7 hours of cooking so you have about 50 strangers like sitting in their little hovel. What are they doing? What are they doing? what are they doing for those 7 hours like what are the.

02:05:59.78
Rachel
In milling about with your sick kid. Yeah, oh yeah, right? Yeah, a song on repeat right.

02:06:01.94
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Oh no, they're spilling out into the street. There's they're clearly singing songs to each other I mean this isn't this is a musical mike.

02:06:12.12
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah I don't even want to know the key party going on at Fred's house like with those 2 ugly muppets like it's like all right charades is over close off. Let's go justs.

02:06:18.72
Rachel
Oh.

02:06:27.92
Rachel
Let's do it. Also I think there are like as far as Muppet movie goes is Mike Michael Kane's really the only important human I mean granted his he's got his girlfriend and then his.

02:06:28.60
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Keys in the bowl. Let's do this.

02:06:30.16
mikechumpchange
Yeah, ah my god.

02:06:36.84
mikechumpchange
He is.

02:06:42.54
mikechumpchange
Move? Yeah, yeah, yeah, agree.

02:06:44.24
Rachel
Nephew and her his wife but I feel like those are the only humans that have any impact in this story. Everyone else is Muppet and I'm like low low number of humans for a muppet movie which I kind of I don't know I think it adds to it I really like that I'm like.

02:06:47.62
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Those are the prominent ones. Yeah, which is a very very different.

02:06:58.62
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, that's become I mean that's that's where the the meme comes from the okay take um, take a movie and 1 actor is in it and then everyone else is played by muppets like that's that's where this is essentially the thing that starts that that whole meme. Um.

02:07:04.21
Rachel
Okay.

02:07:12.41
mikechumpchange
Just.

02:07:17.59
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Because that's kind of what they do in um muppet treasure island as well I mean you've got Jennifer Saunders at the beginning and Billy Connolly and then Tim Curry but like that's it's like there are like there are a couple of other people as like among the pirates. But that's it.

02:07:19.56
mikechumpchange
Who.

02:07:20.87
Rachel
Yes, what.

02:07:27.92
mikechumpchange
Remember.

02:07:29.91
Rachel
Let's just my pit.

02:07:34.24
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, and so that becomes that until muppets from space and then you get like all the cameos in that movie like everybody's in that movie which is I think harkens back more to the muppet movie Muppet Caper great or take Manhattan kind of run of the original trilogy like that.

02:07:39.37
Rachel
Ever.

02:07:40.97
mikechumpchange
Now.

02:07:47.94
Rachel
Um, yeah, yes.

02:07:52.25
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
In a lot of ways harkens back to that one? Um, so yeah.

02:07:56.52
Rachel
It's magic the blend of just a muppet and a human dancing together in the background of a scene. It is like what it's perfect. We love it. Yeah.

02:07:59.94
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yeah, it's great. We love it. We love to see it.

02:08:04.99
mikechumpchange
love it. absolutely love it so I think that's it I think we've covered a muppet Christmas Carol. Um, if you have a chance to check it out. it is on Disney plus it is on hulu think the I have like hulu with commercials but it was running commercial free on mine which was great.

02:08:09.22
Rachel
Yes.

02:08:19.75
Rachel
Same.

02:08:19.85
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
It is nice.

02:08:22.62
mikechumpchange
And I actually bought it on fork. It was like eight bucks to buy on four k on Apple so I purchased it on four k so I would do that as well I watched it in my like watch it at school yesterday in my office I'm like no kids need counseling today. So I am watching this in the background. Yeah.

02:08:28.52
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Nice.

02:08:37.14
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Last day before break who needs counseling.

02:08:38.45
Rachel
We'll do that truth.

02:08:41.56
mikechumpchange
I would go in because it was pajama day and I would go to the middle schoolers I'm like I thought it was pajama day they're like it is I'm like you're wearing the same clothes you wear every day and they would get so mad like no, we're not and I'm like no you literally are wearing the same clothes. Also you have a math test. You know that right? they're like what I'm like yeah.

02:08:58.34
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um.

02:08:58.92
Rachel
Um, go on get does sound great I personally still watch it on my vhs copy from 1992 so I get the previews and I full grade. Love it.

02:08:59.52
mikechumpchange
Ah, you know their teachers giving you a ma to and then I would leave. It was awesome. Um, they would be great All that's great. It's fantastic.

02:09:09.47
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
9 is. Yeah, yeah.

02:09:15.36
Rachel
And it has the song.

02:09:17.25
mikechumpchange
Excellent. So on that note, let's do some plugs. Everybody's favorite part of the show I hear that people skip ahead to the very end just to hear the plugs Rachel answer.

02:09:24.37
Rachel
Um, gay. Um, yeah.

02:09:27.60
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I Mean if you if you do that? go back and listen to the whole podcast as well. Please.

02:09:33.66
mikechumpchange
Or don't whenever you want hey you know what you can do whatever you want. It's totally fine. Um, yeah, just yeah, so Rachel where can the listeners find tell us a little bit about your artwork and your photography where can folks find it and what's it all about.

02:09:36.51
Rachel
Um, just give them your money and listen to whatever you want.

02:09:46.93
Rachel
Yeah, so I do like we said before a lot of like dude photography I'm very body positive and just in the way that like I think feel like when you say body positive people like love your body I'm like yes, love your body but also like let's recognize all the beautiful flawed fucked up things that our bodies do and capture them and. Feel good in that. So I love that people feel good after getting photos of themselves from me like it's a awesome enlightening. Wonderful sexy experience I think that's super fun. So you can see all of my artwork I have a Patreon um myself unfortunately, as is the way of censorship. You can't. Find me on Patreon you have to Google my name plus the word patreon because if you create what they deem adult content. You can't be searched for on the site. Um, so my name is Rachel Schwaybak S C H W E B A C H if you search for that in Patreon I'll come up and I've been putting work on there for about 7 years now photos videos all sorts of work like that I will yeah and I'm on Twitter under indie smut peddler. Um, because from Indianapolis I'm actually I did a really great black christmas shoot that is coming out tomorrow because I have a creepy whole attic.

02:10:45.40
mikechumpchange
Send me that and I will make sure that goes in the show notes. So people can click it right from.

02:10:59.69
mikechumpchange
Oh very cool.

02:11:03.69
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
How wonderful.

02:11:04.16
Rachel
Right? above me so we got to use that. Um, yeah, you can find me on Twitter you can find me on the internet again very hard to find so you got to just kind of Google my name and I'll show up and if you're local if you're in Indianapolis I hang out and perform at the white rabbit cabaret an amazing cabaret here in town. It's.

02:11:19.33
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, that it's a great venue that is a great venue.

02:11:22.42
Rachel
It is the best place the people who work there are amazing there and in fact, he said people don't talk about muppets we talk about muppets all the time like I hang out with a group of Muppet positive clowns and other wild freaks who we love the muppets so come talk muppets with us if you're ever in Indianapolis.

02:11:29.99
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Hell yes.

02:11:37.51
mikechumpchange
Excellent, excellent Stephen what is going on with disenfranchise a new month coming up. What is you just did the three black christmases for December and what is going on with january.

02:11:39.47
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Hell yeah.

02:11:44.33
Rachel
So.

02:11:50.23
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Right? Ah, well, we're going to finish out the year as we always do with the a failed franchise starter from the year we just finished so we're doing 2023 is the flash next week. And then we're going to take a bi week bi week by week by week and then we're going to do. We're actually got another theme month coming up. We're going to do a Stephen King at failed franchise starters I'm calling it the drawing of 3 because we're covering because we're taking a biweek so we got three weeks left in January so we're doing.

02:12:11.10
Rachel
Yes.

02:12:20.60
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Stephen King Movies I think we're doing um, we're doing night flyer we're doing Christine and we're going to do ah the remake of Carrie the twenty thirteen remake of Carrie we've we've done dark tower.

02:12:28.50
mikechumpchange
No no dark Tower is a failed. Oh okay.

02:12:28.93
Rachel
Okay.

02:12:35.38
Rachel
Okay.

02:12:37.47
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Um, we've done dark tower that was we had um Mandy and Molly Gossage a couple of really great um longtime Stephen King fans that I've known forever came on to do that one when firestarter came out. We did that one so we've done that one. But yeah.

02:12:40.79
mikechumpchange
Kind of.

02:12:52.70
mikechumpchange
Um, and I think I'm coming back on for Valentine's day as is tradition right? And what are we doing for this year we're doing a movie called valentine.

02:12:54.21
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Yes, yes, of course we are doing a movie called Valentine it is a it is not that it's not the slasher we've we did that one last year the slasher valentine we did last year this one is I think it's a.

02:12:58.64
Rachel
Um, will.

02:13:04.62
Rachel
Um, amazing movie. Oh oh.

02:13:12.76
mikechumpchange
Hindu.

02:13:13.69
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Not, It's like a it's definitely a foreign. It's It's based on a foreign comic book superhero called Valentine and I I I can't find these comics anywhere I have been looking I don't know where they are.

02:13:20.39
Rachel
Oh.

02:13:27.76
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Ah, but it's like the movie itself is on Amazon prime and it's called valentine think it came out in like 2017 but yeah I gave Mike like a list of movies and he's like that one and I was like all right here we go. So yeah, we're gonna Mike's going to come on for our our annual Valentine's episode as he is done.

02:13:33.12
Rachel
L one.

02:13:45.40
mikechumpchange
Yeah, and what the 2 my bloody valentines valentine with David Borerianas in

02:13:45.52
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Every this will be the fourth year in a row. You've come on for our valentines episode. So yep and then the 1 time you didn't come on for Valentine's was when we talked about the Friday the thirteenth re make so this will be your this will be your fifth time on the main feed. So.

02:13:49.88
Rachel
Yes, and here.

02:13:58.65
Rachel
See four and.

02:13:58.85
mikechumpchange
Um, yeah, so there we go excellent. Oh that would be fantastic. All right listen and where can they find you Stephen.

02:14:04.78
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
I Got I got to get your jacket mailed out to you.

02:14:11.88
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Disenfranchise were on ah most forms of social media at disenfranch pod including Patreon and then you can find me at Chey Walrus um pretty much most forms of social media I'm not on Twitter as much anymore. But yeah, come find me.

02:14:26.74
mikechumpchange
Excellent, all right listeners. You know the spiel I'll try to be quick I'll try to be fast today but ads always say the easiest way you can support our show ah quick and easy thing you can do is if you go to Apple Podcasts make sure that you rate us 5 stars. Leave us a couple lines in a review. Ah like just why you love the show and then subscribe to us like we've been stuck at about 120 reviews for a few weeks now so if a few of you new listeners which we know there are some new ones leave us those 5 stars and a few sentences like that would be a fantastic christmas gift. And subscribe to us. You make sure you don't miss an episode if you listen to us on on Spotify hit that 5 star review button that's super easy way to support the show and it helps new listeners find us every day an even better way to so to support our show is give us your money. Ah, go to patreon.com ah pod and at patreon.com/podintheenddulumonce we get to 50 subscribers which I'll admit we are a long way from because you know we don't pay a ton of attentionsion to the Patreon um shouldn't put it like that. Let's start that over. Subscribe to our Patreon that we don't pay. We actually do pay pretty good amount to it now. Um an even better way to support. The show is become a patron of the show go to pod and the pendulum go to patreon.com/pod and the pendulum.

02:15:40.69
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
And.

02:15:41.52
Rachel
Um.

02:15:54.75
mikechumpchange
Become a patron today. We just posted our talk on godzilla minus one for our patrons that was Brian myself and Michelle Egan of the movies for life pod like Brian's co-hosts had a really fun discussion on that we have. New episodes up every month along with ah other cool stuff that goes a long way to like letting us you know continue the show not only picking up the movies but also books documentaries and other supporting material. Um on the socials. We're on Twitter at pod and pendulum. Ron Blueski as well and we're gonna do some other socials next year what's coming up next week January First that will be our best of 2023 episode and then our first franchise of 2024 all the universal Frankenstein movies all 8 of them starting with Frankenstein. Can't wait I actually already have my notes almost done for it. The goal is to maybe record it early because I'm on Christmas break. It's the first day of Christmas vacation for us. Maybe get a little ahead of the game. Brian and I have already planned out some stuff. Super excited. Can't wait to cover all 8 of these things listeners. Thank you so much. We hope you're if you're hope you're enjoying the holiday wherever you are um, thanks for supporting the show. Thanks for listening. It's been a phenomenal year.

02:17:24.59
mikechumpchange
Thanks to all my co-hosts. Um, there's 7 of you so I'm not going to go through all the names right now because I feel like I'll forget one Rachel thanks for jumping on and please come back. You are okay, this has been awesome and happy holidays. Everyone.

02:17:29.21
Stephen a_k_a_ Chewy
Power a.

02:17:31.16
Rachel
Um.

02:17:36.80
Rachel
I'd love to thanks for having me This was great.

02:17:42.37
mikechumpchange
Take care.