LAND OF THE DEAD

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I proclaim this the summer of
George.

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Hey there everybody, welcome to
the pod and the pendulum.

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We are the show that covers all
the horror movie franchises one

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movie and one episode at a time.
As always, I'm your host Mike's

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Noonian and the Summer of George
continues with this week's

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offering 2000 fives a Land of
the Dead.

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As always, I'm not alone sitting
in the Co host chair from Bloody

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Disgusting Manor, Vellum and the
forthcoming podcast Holy

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Terrors, Mr. Brian Kiper.
Brian, how are we?

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I'm doing just fine.
I'm feeling a little bit like

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The Walking Dead today, I'll
have to admit.

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But hey, a little extra tired
means a little extra nerve

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divergent, so it should be fine.
I.

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Am definitely feeling definitely
feeling that rundown feeling

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right now and we're barely
working like we're on summer

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break and oh I know I don't know
what it is.

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It's just like.
In my situation, our dog isn't

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doing, he's feeling, he's not
feeling so good.

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So he's been up a lot and so, so
of the rest of us.

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And so that's, that's where,
that's where I'm at.

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But I'm good boy.
Guy.

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Like I said, maybe a little
extra spicy today.

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Let's say, well, we look forward
to that.

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I hope we look forward to that.
Joining us again, formerly of

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Ghouls Magazine, all the way
from the UK.

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Let's welcome film Blogger in
all around zombie fiend, Miss

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Sarah Miles.
Sarah, how are we doing?

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I'm doing pretty good and
there's some pretty good vibes

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here because the England ladies
just won the Euro football, so

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that's pretty cool.
Nice.

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So is it chaos there?
Like do people go bananas for

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like the women's sports as well?
Like if if England wins the cup.

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Not as much, although you know,
most of it's kind of pretty much

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acknowledged that usually the
ladies football team play a lot

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better than the men's.
I was there last summer when the

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men's team went to the was it
the Euro Cup?

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Yeah, yeah.
Euro, they made it all the way

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to the finals.
And I have to say that like one

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of the coolest sports watching
experiences I ever had was like

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being in a pub in Cornwall with
like a ton of people, like

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literally shoulder to shoulder
with people and just having

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everybody.
It reminded me honestly, the

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closest thing to that was like
2004 when the Boston Red Sox

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like went won the World Series
for the first time in 86 years.

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Like there's nothing else like
that.

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So it was really cool.
Oh yeah, like when we do go hard

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for sports in this country, we
we go hard.

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Now, would you fancy yourself a
soccer hooligan?

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Like, are you someone that's
going to roll up the sleeves and

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maybe ship somebody after a hard
game?

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Yeah, give them the good old
Chelsea Grin.

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No, no, I mean, my, my, my
parents and one of my brothers,

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they like it a lot more than me.
I just, I'm sorry.

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It's more a case of like, I'll
stick my head in the room, be

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like, oh, OK, we're winning.
OK, that's more than my wife

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will do.
Who?

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Famously picked up our kitten at
the time and told the room full

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of my friends we were scaring
the cat when we were all

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cheering so loud during a game.
So she is one of those like, oh

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boy, sports ball people.
So you know, but my dad.

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Also does like a bit of your
guys's football as well like he

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he does.
He does like a bit of NFL.

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We keep trying to make it the
thing over there and I don't

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think it quite lands.
I don't think we're there.

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We just one of those.
We have our, our soccer program

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here in Seattle is pretty
popular.

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It's the, the, the Sounders.
But yeah, we don't go crazy

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around here.
I mean, when the Seahawks won

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the Super Bowl, yeah, we we only
burn the city down.

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You know when you know, like UHO
is here or whatever or no, not

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WH the World Trade WTO, the
World Trade Organization, We we

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burned, we burned the city down
then, but.

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I was thinking Roger Daltrey.
When Roger Daltrey, Yeah, shows

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up, we riot.
We.

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Yeah.
But I remember when the Seahawks

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won the Super Bowl and the bus
came back, they just sort of

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were lining the sidewalks very
nicely, welcoming it and back

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and it was cool.
But it's like, we're so nice

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around here.
Yeah.

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We're a little bit of both.
I think we're it's points I can

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get a bit frightening, but
overall I think that it hasn't

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been too too bad.
Like when the Duck folks aren't

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rolling and remember the parade
for the O4 Red Sox on my friend

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Nate yelling at Johnny Damon
that he wanted to have his baby.

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So that's about as raucous as we
got.

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You know what?
Let's talk a little bit about

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this movie.
I could go on and on forever

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that.
Might be a tangent film that I.

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Know yeah, so this might be one
of those tangent, although this

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is a fun movie.
Like I have a fun.

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Story Let's do a little bit of
housekeeping and then get right

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into it.
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super long way to new listeners
finding us.

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Welcome new listeners who have
found us through our Summer of

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George series.
You can go to our website pod on

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the Pendulum where we have all
of our back episodes listed.

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You can leave review there's,
you can leave us emails there,

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make comments.
It's really easy to search

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through and find.
I think Steven said we're now up

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to like 3738 franchises that
we've covered since 2019.

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Become a patron if you really
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And for as little as 2 bucks a
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take on Shadow of the Vampire,

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which concludes his series on
Nosferatu.

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And Steven and I just did about
two hours on 2025 Superman,

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which will be up as right before
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July.
So tons of really cool stuff up

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at patreon.com/pot on the
Pendulum.

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And that is it for housekeeping.
Let's get right into it.

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Sarah, as our guest, can you
remind us or tell us about the

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first time you caught Romero's
Land of the Dead?

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And were you at that point like
as much of A zombie fan as you

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are now?
Relatively relatively as you

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know, I mean, I wouldn't say I
was maybe as widely watched, but

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I I definitely did like the
genre.

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Unfortunately, there's nothing
to kind of like too spectacular

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about the first time I watched
it.

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I think it was just kind of like
a case of just kind of like a

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bored afternoon was like, oh,
hey, I should finally watch

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this.
And that was it.

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I can imagine that the
atmosphere at the time when it

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came out was in some ways kind
of akin to when Star Wars

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Episode 1 came out.
Sure.

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Like, like, you know, that long
gap in between, Yeah, the old

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and the new sort of things.
I I can imagine.

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That was a that was a good
atmosphere.

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Yeah, I would probably say on a
smaller scale, but maybe with

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like the intensity of that for
the diehards as we'll get into

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where did this, I guess maybe
we'll talk about it more when

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like we get into the movie
itself.

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But did like the zombie films
that had come out like just

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before this kind of create more
of a resurgence or like re

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interest in in this like genre
film for you?

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I mean, it's like it wasn't
around that time that I saw it

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was only kind of like, I would
say maybe, I don't know, 7-8

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years ago maybe, OK.
It.

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Really was just like AI need to
catch up with this.

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I mean, it's like at the time I
knew of it obviously.

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And of course you did have
around the same time like Shaun

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of the Dead and the Dawn of the
Dead remake.

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So I mean, it's kind of a case
of it's like, would we still

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have this if it wasn't for those
films and, and particularly the

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popularity of like, because I
think Dawn of the Dead did quite

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well at the box office.
So yeah, it's interesting to

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kind of like case of it's just
like how the essentially the

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father of the genre wasn't able
to get another one of his films

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made until kind of like these
other people drew from him and

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got popular.
Yeah, we'll definitely dive into

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that and what was going on and
what kind of got this film maybe

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over the finish line out of like
development hell after a couple

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years.
Brian, how about yourself?

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Well.
I was thinking about what was

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going on around 2005 for me, and
I just wasn't watching a lot of

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horror at the time.
I wasn't seeing any of it in the

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theater.
I there the one exception

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because every movie I saw, I saw
with my wife at that time.

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We were pretty recently married.
You know, it was like around

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three years of marriage for us
at that time.

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And I was very busy with my
first career, which took a lot

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of, took, you know, frankly, too
much time of life to get to get

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rolling.
Is that your Chippendale dancer?

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Yeah, Sage.
Yeah, exactly.

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Just like that.
Me and me and Patrick Swayze and

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Chris Farley, you know, we're
all together in that.

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But yeah, actually that was my,
that was my the reason.

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Well, one of the reasons maybe I
wasn't watching a lot of horror

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was I was a church worship
director, so I was very Jesusy.

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And I don't know if you would
have.

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I don't know if I need to go too
far into all that.

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I am fascinated.
No, please.

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Do well, you know, it was, it
was my, I'd gone to college to

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be a music teacher, but I knew I
wasn't going to be a music

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teacher.
My plan was always to be a, a

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music director for churches.
And then I got into it and you

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are very overworked, very
underpaid, and there's not a lot

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of room or ways to advance very
easily and things like that.

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So it was, it was very draining
and.

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Yeah.
But after 10 years, I finally

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figured that out and jumped back
into my What I went to college

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for and teaching has just been a
better fit.

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That's all.
I and.

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There's more, as we know,
teachers.

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Yeah, teachers are teachers.
Are never overworked and

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underpaid.
No, teaching is never training.

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No, but honestly comparatively
it's been much better situation.

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That's good to hear.
And so when the Holy Terrors

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podcast starts playing, you'll
you'll hear the more of the

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story, I'm sure if you listen.
But so the but anyway, even if

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that wasn't the case, I wasn't
seeing a lot of movies by

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myself.
I was going with my wife, you

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know, and the only horror movie
I can remember, or scary movie,

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I should say, I remember us
seeing together was Open Water.

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And there was a trailer for
Shaun of the Dead at the

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beginning of that.
And I remember thinking that

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looks amazing.
And I was right.

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But Land of the Dead, I, as I've
mentioned in the previous

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episodes, I liked all of the
previous movies to some extent,

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though Day at first was, I don't
know, a little extra disturbing

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to me, I guess.
But I was looking forward to

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this and I, but I didn't think
I'd see it theatrically, which I

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didn't, but I ended up renting
it.

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You know, there was still when
Blockbuster and Hollywood Video

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were around.
So I, I rented it some night and

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I watched it and it was like,
all right, you know, not bad,

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some kind of interesting stuff.
And I didn't really think about

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it since then until watching it
what, 2 days ago to talk about

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00:13:08,800 --> 00:13:12,000
it with you fine folks.
So and I like it.

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00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:15,920
I think it's a fun movie.
Not a ton of subtext in this.

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00:13:15,920 --> 00:13:19,120
I mean, the subtext is text of
this one, right?

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00:13:20,200 --> 00:13:23,760
And which is, but you know what,
there were things like I had

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listened.
I was, I used to listen to audio

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00:13:25,800 --> 00:13:27,920
commentaries all the time.
Like I'd listen to the Dawn of

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the dead commentary.
And he's talking about with

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Sonic Tom Savini, how he's
writing a fourth one called Dead

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00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:39,320
Reckoning, and it's about 911
and the the gulf between rich

224
00:13:39,320 --> 00:13:41,480
and poor and all this.
I'm like, OK.

225
00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:47,240
And so eventually they got it
made and it was obviously under

226
00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:51,840
this different title, but you
know, that's just, I haven't

227
00:13:51,840 --> 00:13:54,480
really thought much of it since
seeing it initially.

228
00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:56,400
So.
But you know, I like it well

229
00:13:56,400 --> 00:13:59,200
enough.
Yeah, it's a fun film.

230
00:13:59,200 --> 00:14:03,760
I know for myself like this was
actually a pretty like the the

231
00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:09,000
actual experiencing this movie
was more enjoyable maybe than

232
00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:12,440
the movie itself, which I do
think is a fun pretty enjoyable

233
00:14:12,440 --> 00:14:16,440
zombie flick.
Like at the time I lived with

234
00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:21,800
like 8 or 9 other guys at a
house in Alston right near

235
00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:25,360
downtown Boston.
And like our house was like the

236
00:14:25,960 --> 00:14:30,680
kind of like early 30s like punk
rock house where we were all in

237
00:14:30,680 --> 00:14:35,040
bands or did other art projects
but also like had jobs and could

238
00:14:35,040 --> 00:14:38,000
pay bills.
Like our days of let's like now

239
00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:41,160
live in a dump.
We're like well behind us and

240
00:14:41,560 --> 00:14:44,880
our house is just the one that
people tended to gravitate

241
00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:47,480
towards.
Like we'd throw barbecues and

242
00:14:47,480 --> 00:14:49,040
bands would play in the
backyard.

243
00:14:49,040 --> 00:14:54,080
We had a toga party on the 4th
of July where my wife, then

244
00:14:54,080 --> 00:14:57,440
girlfriend like met all of my
friends for the first time, like

245
00:14:57,440 --> 00:15:00,640
wearing a bed sheet.
And I remember like coming down

246
00:15:00,640 --> 00:15:04,200
at like 2:00 in the morning piss
drunk from that night.

247
00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:08,720
And there's like 25 people I've
never met before all playing

248
00:15:08,720 --> 00:15:12,520
some instrument or another in
the living room and being like

249
00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:14,560
all right, I'm just going back
to bed.

250
00:15:14,560 --> 00:15:17,960
Like they can sort this out.
You didn't grab the guitar and

251
00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:20,880
just smash it against the wall.
No, we did not.

252
00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:22,400
No, because we they were our
friends.

253
00:15:22,400 --> 00:15:25,800
Like to me, this was like the
coolest thing in the world.

254
00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:29,400
Just just toga parties and no
pollution that's I had.

255
00:15:29,400 --> 00:15:31,560
I had to make an Animal House
reference.

256
00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:36,280
Not give my love a cherry that
night, although she she like

257
00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:39,560
basically carried me home from
the bridge where the fire we

258
00:15:39,560 --> 00:15:43,640
could see the fireworks 'cause I
was in no position to move.

259
00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:48,160
And we found a banana pie on the
front stoop and just ate banana

260
00:15:48,160 --> 00:15:51,960
pie and said and it was just one
of the best.

261
00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:55,000
Experiences come from.
It was just on like people

262
00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:56,600
brought it to the BBQ.
OK.

263
00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:58,760
OK.
So that makes sense.

264
00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:00,960
Now, yeah, it was like a banana
cream pie.

265
00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:05,160
And we just went to town on a
banana cream pie on the 4th of

266
00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:07,240
July.
So and like our house, like

267
00:16:07,280 --> 00:16:10,680
every, we had a message board we
all belong to back when those

268
00:16:10,680 --> 00:16:13,440
were a thing.
And I just started a horror

269
00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:16,760
movie night on Sundays where I'm
like, hey, if anyone's around,

270
00:16:17,160 --> 00:16:19,720
I'm going to like, throw some
burgers on the grill and then

271
00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:23,880
put on a couple horror movies
around like 7:00 if anyone wants

272
00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:25,920
to come over.
Just don't be an asshole.

273
00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:30,000
Invariably, we would have, like,
at its peak, maybe a dozen

274
00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:32,960
people just show up, bring a
couple beers or something to

275
00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:35,640
eat, and we throw on a couple
horror movies.

276
00:16:35,640 --> 00:16:38,760
And it was just like a couple of
those people I'm still like very

277
00:16:38,760 --> 00:16:41,160
good friends with.
That sounds perfect.

278
00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:42,000
Really.
That is like.

279
00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:46,240
I'd miss those days so much
that, yeah, just having folks

280
00:16:46,240 --> 00:16:49,080
over for stuff like that.
We.

281
00:16:49,440 --> 00:16:52,800
So when Land of the Dead came
out, we decided let's do

282
00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:55,840
something special.
And we decided we were going to

283
00:16:55,840 --> 00:16:59,440
have like a zombie shuffle to
the theater because we lived

284
00:16:59,440 --> 00:17:02,160
like right near the train line
that would drop us off a few

285
00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:05,520
blocks from the Regal Theater at
Fenway Park.

286
00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:09,680
So we took whatever clothes
you're going to wear and we

287
00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:12,640
rolled them around in all the
dirt so it would look like we

288
00:17:12,640 --> 00:17:16,599
had come up from the grave.
And a bunch of us, like, did a

289
00:17:16,599 --> 00:17:20,079
bunch of zombie makeup and
prosthetics and, you know, just

290
00:17:20,079 --> 00:17:24,440
looked all gross and disgusting.
And we rode the train the, the

291
00:17:24,440 --> 00:17:28,920
like 5 or 6 stops from our
house, about a dozen of us, 2

292
00:17:29,320 --> 00:17:33,200
Lansdowne St. in in Kendall
Square, which is where the Red

293
00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:37,440
Sox play, but also is where,
like at the time all of the

294
00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:40,520
nightclubs were.
So on a Friday night, if you

295
00:17:40,520 --> 00:17:44,040
would go to Kendall Square and
you would go to Lansdowne St. in

296
00:17:44,040 --> 00:17:48,360
particular, there would be like
all the college kids, like

297
00:17:48,360 --> 00:17:52,440
dressed up to the nines just
going to have a good time.

298
00:17:52,680 --> 00:17:56,200
And we get off the train and we
just start shambling towards all

299
00:17:56,200 --> 00:18:00,480
of these like super drunk
college kids that were dressed

300
00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:03,200
for essentially like college
prom.

301
00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:07,880
And but definitely I'm like,
huh, like I thought, you know, I

302
00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:09,840
thought like Romero was a bigger
deal.

303
00:18:09,840 --> 00:18:14,560
Like it didn't measure up to me,
like Shawn of the Dead or 28

304
00:18:14,760 --> 00:18:19,000
Days Later or even Zack Snyder's
remake of Dawn of the Dead.

305
00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:21,240
I thought, you know, it was a
good, fun movie.

306
00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:23,800
Sarah, you just made a face.
I don't.

307
00:18:23,840 --> 00:18:26,480
Know what you're talking about?
No, that's all right.

308
00:18:28,920 --> 00:18:33,040
But the movie itself, like it
was decent, and it's something

309
00:18:33,040 --> 00:18:37,000
that's grown on me over time.
It does have all the subtlety of

310
00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:41,720
a sledgehammer to the groin, but
that's OK sometimes.

311
00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:44,880
So yeah, that was my experience
seeing this.

312
00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:47,200
All right.
Should we get into the

313
00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:49,520
background a little bit?
Let's do.

314
00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:54,280
It all right, so I've just
talked a lot, so maybe I'll kick

315
00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:58,120
it over to you.
Brian and Sarah, can you guys

316
00:18:58,120 --> 00:19:00,760
talk a little bit?
Like to me it feels like post

317
00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:05,360
Day of the Dead and that one is
a bit of, I don't want to say a

318
00:19:05,360 --> 00:19:09,680
flop, but it definitely
commercially underperformed and

319
00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:13,640
fans didn't like it as much of
as Dawn of the Dead that it felt

320
00:19:13,640 --> 00:19:18,600
like Romero was in a down swing
creatively and commercially.

321
00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:22,200
And the zombie sub genre as well
from the mid 80s to this.

322
00:19:22,200 --> 00:19:24,320
What was going on for Romero at
this time?

323
00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:28,680
Well, I mean, I mean, he did.
He did write the script for the

324
00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:32,000
remake of Night the Living Dead,
which Tom Savini directed in, I

325
00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:38,800
want to say 1990.
Yeah, and then you also had

326
00:19:39,160 --> 00:19:42,920
Tales from the Dark Side, which
I haven't seen, but I've heard

327
00:19:42,920 --> 00:19:44,680
good things.
Yeah.

328
00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:46,440
And I saw that in theaters as a
kid.

329
00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:49,360
It was one of the first R rated
movies I ever stuck into.

330
00:19:49,800 --> 00:19:50,240
It's.
The.

331
00:19:50,240 --> 00:19:52,720
Real.
It's the real Creepshow 3.

332
00:19:53,400 --> 00:19:55,840
Yeah, OK.
Yeah, it's it's much more along

333
00:19:55,840 --> 00:19:59,000
those lines than than the actual
Creepshow three.

334
00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:01,840
Yeah, movie.
Directed by John Harrison, his

335
00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:06,120
composer and collaborator.
It's really fun I I highly

336
00:20:06,120 --> 00:20:09,520
recommend it.
I need to watch more anthology

337
00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:12,920
horror like I have seen the like
Creepshow and Trick or Treat and

338
00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:14,840
things like that but I really
need to like like look into it

339
00:20:14,840 --> 00:20:16,960
more.
Sorry, tangent.

340
00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:20,920
That's OK.
And of course he did the dark

341
00:20:20,920 --> 00:20:23,080
half the Stephen King
adaptation.

342
00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:27,160
And of course, Stephen King's
the copy of same slot had its

343
00:20:27,160 --> 00:20:31,480
little cameo in Day of the Dead
with Bob.

344
00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:36,680
But although fun fact, Romero
was going to do Pet Sematary

345
00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:40,160
1999, but it was just like a
scheduling thing.

346
00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:43,480
They weren't able to arrange it
and then Mary Lambert didn't

347
00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:45,360
instead.
But I think that would have been

348
00:20:45,360 --> 00:20:48,280
an interesting one.
If if I like, I love Pet

349
00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:51,600
Sematary, but I think I think
that that is kind of a very

350
00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:56,320
interesting kind of what if.
My hot take is I've come around

351
00:20:56,320 --> 00:21:01,360
in like Mary Lambert's Pet
Sematary too say that I've heard

352
00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:03,240
a.
Few people say that, actually.

353
00:21:03,360 --> 00:21:06,880
I kind of agree.
I I think that obviously the the

354
00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:11,640
story of the first film is it's
a based on the novel.

355
00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:15,240
It's a much more serious, you
know, idea and all of that.

356
00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:18,720
But I think that too is just so
much fun.

357
00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:21,880
It's it's got a little bit of a
moon streak to it, but it's,

358
00:21:21,880 --> 00:21:26,840
although it's, it's, I don't
know the, the it's, it's playing

359
00:21:26,840 --> 00:21:31,280
in the sandbox in a way of that
mythos that I think is really

360
00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:33,880
intelligent and fun.
I really like that one.

361
00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:38,440
It's like Gremlins 2IN that she
had a blank check to do whatever

362
00:21:38,440 --> 00:21:43,120
she wanted and Lambert has like
a very kind of like punk rock

363
00:21:43,120 --> 00:21:47,360
sensibility to her filmmaking
and that's what Pet Sematary 2

364
00:21:47,360 --> 00:21:50,200
is.
Where as good as the original 1

365
00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:54,280
is and it's a solid like late
80s horror movie, it kind of

366
00:21:54,280 --> 00:21:59,280
like a slavish recreation of the
novel in a lot of ways.

367
00:21:59,720 --> 00:22:03,480
And I also felt kind of like the
miscast with the main

368
00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:07,040
performances, like they weren't
my favorite, so.

369
00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:08,440
Really.
Yeah.

370
00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:11,200
I mean, I think the best cast
person in the original Pet

371
00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:14,680
Sematary is Fred Guinn as Judd.
Oh yeah, that's true.

372
00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:17,200
I should give him a pass.
He's fantastic.

373
00:22:17,600 --> 00:22:23,720
Yeah, so here's the.
Others I think little.

374
00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:26,280
He's great in that.
For a little kid performances, I

375
00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:27,600
think for a little bird is
great.

376
00:22:28,360 --> 00:22:34,720
Yeah, yeah, I will say I my hot
take on Romero in the dark half

377
00:22:34,720 --> 00:22:38,680
is I think he would have been a
better choice for the kind of

378
00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:41,600
quasi sequel to that which is
Needful Things.

379
00:22:42,120 --> 00:22:45,440
I don't know if if you've ever
read that novel, there's like a

380
00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:49,760
real satirical streak to it.
Like, it's very dark, but also,

381
00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:54,240
like, really funny and rife with
a lot of commentary on

382
00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:58,360
consumerism and community,
which, to me, those would fall

383
00:22:58,360 --> 00:23:01,520
right into Romero's wheelhouse.
And I think he could have

384
00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:05,080
knocked that one out of the park
where the dark half is a bit

385
00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:09,960
more straightforward.
You know, like King at that time

386
00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:14,880
was really kind of ruminating on
his alter ego that had just been

387
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:16,720
outed.
Well, it's weird because

388
00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:21,880
frankly, I was going to say the
dark half almost feels like a

389
00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:26,600
Bachmann story because it has
that sort of blunt force trauma

390
00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:31,320
to it where because I remember
read that was one of the first

391
00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:35,520
books that I read, but from King
when it first came out, I think

392
00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:38,760
that was the first one that I
bought right when it came out

393
00:23:38,760 --> 00:23:41,280
and read.
And I was just like, man, it's

394
00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:47,160
it's like it's it's really,
really mean and it's nasty and

395
00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:52,600
angry and it's got, you know,
someone beaten to death with

396
00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:58,000
their own prosthetic arm and you
know, I it's it's really a mean

397
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:02,640
little book.
And whereas, you know, before

398
00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:05,520
that I had read, you know,
movies, books, I mean, that

399
00:24:05,920 --> 00:24:10,640
aren't necessarily, you know,
warm and fuzzy, cuddly, like The

400
00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:14,160
Shining and stuff, but still
there was something different

401
00:24:14,160 --> 00:24:16,360
about those ones before that for
me.

402
00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:20,000
And so when I read The Dark
Half, I was like, good Lord, he

403
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:22,680
just was.
And I was in like 6th grade and

404
00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:25,640
I was like, wow, he's really
pissed off here.

405
00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:31,520
Was King clean by then?
I kind of feel like The Tommy

406
00:24:31,520 --> 00:24:36,760
Doctors is his last book when he
was like really in the thralls

407
00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:40,520
of addiction and I think by the
Dark F he had like cleaned up

408
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:44,320
and I wonder how much of the
meanness is kind of getting

409
00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:48,760
through that tough transition.
It was the, as I understand the

410
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:51,480
early days of his, of his
sobriety.

411
00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:55,840
That makes a lot of sense.
He, I think he started it.

412
00:24:55,840 --> 00:24:58,880
He was working on it while he
was making Maximum OverDrive.

413
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:02,680
He was like writing it at the
same time as he was directing

414
00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:06,440
that movie, which is like, OK,
you can't do that unless you're,

415
00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:10,120
as you have so eloquently said
in the past, sucking half of

416
00:25:10,120 --> 00:25:13,040
Bolivia up your nose.
But I believe he finished that

417
00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:18,400
book sober.
So I don't which say what you

418
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:25,280
will about that, it's so.
But yeah, the Tommy Knockers is

419
00:25:25,480 --> 00:25:28,920
clearly like, what the hell is
this?

420
00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:31,760
I don't think I ever finished
the Tommy Knockers.

421
00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:33,040
I think like.
It's it's.

422
00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:35,680
About 100 pages in.
I'm like, I don't have to read

423
00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:38,040
everything by him.
It's one of his worst.

424
00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:42,400
I think like I swear I heard
someone once that King genuinely

425
00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:46,680
can't remember writing Cujo.
Like he knows that he did, but

426
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:49,760
he cannot remember anything
about the process of it because

427
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:51,840
he was just that coked out.
Yeah.

428
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:56,280
Yeah, he wrote that in that's in
on writing his his memoir.

429
00:25:57,480 --> 00:26:00,640
He talks about how he's like, I
like that book, but I don't

430
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:03,120
remember writing.
It, to be fair, he writes so

431
00:26:03,120 --> 00:26:06,080
much.
I mean, there's probably a bunch

432
00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:08,480
of stuff he doesn't even like
sober.

433
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:11,360
He's like, I wrote what?
Like, all right, I got a check

434
00:26:11,360 --> 00:26:12,400
for it.
So yeah.

435
00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:15,080
Well, what else had Romero been
doing?

436
00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:18,800
Not to dive dovetail too much.
Like what else had Romero been

437
00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:22,880
doing at this time?
We've got monkey shines.

438
00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:27,120
Did anyone see monkey shines?
I've I've seen about the 1st 10

439
00:26:27,120 --> 00:26:29,080
minutes of it.
I've seen pieces of it.

440
00:26:29,080 --> 00:26:31,600
Yeah, I've never seen the whole
thing he did.

441
00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:36,480
There was 2 evil lies now that
was him and he did one.

442
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:38,560
I think Argento yeah, did the
other.

443
00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:42,040
It was Argento, both of them
doing like half of a film.

444
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:46,160
Yeah.
And then Bruiser, now Bruiser is

445
00:26:46,240 --> 00:26:50,200
was kind of really hard to see
for a long time.

446
00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:56,080
I think it just got a release on
physical media recently like

447
00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:59,000
Keno put it on, but I've never
seen that one.

448
00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:02,080
And I I don't really know
anything about Bruiser to be

449
00:27:02,120 --> 00:27:04,680
honest.
Again, none of these were

450
00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:07,960
particularly successful
financially.

451
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:13,200
I think the the biggest success
of those was Monkey Shines.

452
00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:17,520
I remember people seeing it, but
it wasn't a hit by any stretch.

453
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:23,360
But I remember that movie coming
out and I remember seeing a

454
00:27:23,360 --> 00:27:29,240
little bit of it on TV, I think.
And they like, we're doing back

455
00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:33,400
surgery on the guy and, and I
was really young and that just

456
00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:35,360
freaked me out.
So I was like, yeah, OK, I'm

457
00:27:35,360 --> 00:27:37,120
done.
So that's as far as I ever got.

458
00:27:37,200 --> 00:27:40,480
All this to say that, you know,
he's kind of in a pretty big

459
00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:44,120
funk overall and just trying to
work within the Hollywood

460
00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:47,000
system.
And that's not who Romero it's

461
00:27:47,120 --> 00:27:47,600
really.
Not.

462
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:54,000
And he says at the time like he
was actually making more money

463
00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:57,320
to not make movies.
Like these films would go into

464
00:27:57,360 --> 00:28:00,640
kind of creative turn around or
they would just get shelved and

465
00:28:00,640 --> 00:28:03,040
he would get money for the
development end of it.

466
00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:05,120
But none of them eventually got
made.

467
00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:08,720
But he was still like, doing
better financially than at any

468
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:11,800
point to like when he was
actually getting movies greenlit

469
00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:13,160
in the.
Weird.

470
00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:15,880
That's such like a weird way for
it to work.

471
00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:20,960
This this book that I got on
Romero, which is around here

472
00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:23,440
somewhere.
I know this is my I always do

473
00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:27,320
this but it actually.
Has always post stuff from the

474
00:28:27,320 --> 00:28:30,160
shelf.
There's this listing in here

475
00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:35,480
that has not just the films that
got made, but the ones that he

476
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:40,200
wrote drafts for.
And so like in, you know, even

477
00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:45,560
if I just go after Day of the
Dead, there's all these, there's

478
00:28:45,560 --> 00:28:49,480
this huge listing of different
things that he did and I won't

479
00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:51,000
do all of them because it would
take too long.

480
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:54,600
But there's like the
Necronomicon, the Mummy and the

481
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:59,360
return of the Mummy in the mid
80s, Whiz kid, whatever that is,

482
00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:02,200
War of the Worlds, The Night
They Came.

483
00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:09,120
And just like different drafts
of all these different things

484
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:11,960
that he did.
Yeah, another version of the

485
00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:15,680
Mummy in the 90s.
Yeah, he was attached for a

486
00:29:15,680 --> 00:29:19,880
while to the one that eventually
became the Brendan Fraser.

487
00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:23,480
Yeah.
Film that like his, I think at

488
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:26,040
some point will cover that sure
trilogy.

489
00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:28,840
Oh yeah, that's just a fun.
Those first two in particular

490
00:29:28,840 --> 00:29:31,440
are, I don't know if they're
really horror, but they are a

491
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:33,200
lot of fun.
Yeah, they're good at, they're

492
00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:36,520
sort of Raiders of the Lost Ark
adjacent.

493
00:29:36,640 --> 00:29:42,320
But you know, the Raven then of
thinking all the way up to the

494
00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:46,280
early thousands, the girl who
loved Tom Gordon, which is

495
00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:52,280
finally getting made now.
Dracula, She's Tusk 2003.

496
00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:55,920
I don't know what that is.
So like the.

497
00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:58,480
The.
Kevin Smith version.

498
00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:03,000
The Kevin Smith one is 1.
He dreamed of like on a podcast,

499
00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:06,360
just came up with the whole
movie, Yeah, while baked out of

500
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:08,800
his mind, and then decided to
make the.

501
00:30:08,880 --> 00:30:10,680
Movie.
You think?

502
00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:11,680
Yeah.
Yeah.

503
00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:15,520
And so, I mean, he was always
working on treatments and

504
00:30:15,520 --> 00:30:20,160
screenplays and different
things, but there's so few of

505
00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:22,120
them actually got made.
Yeah.

506
00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:24,560
It feels like the thing.
Paid for it.

507
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:26,960
It's probably just so defeat,
like it feels sorry.

508
00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:30,000
It's probably like, it probably
just feels like it's still like

509
00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:32,160
a bit of a defeat in a way that
you know, your projects aren't

510
00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:35,320
getting made and you know,
you're like, you're not getting

511
00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:37,080
to tell these stories you want
to tell.

512
00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:40,840
I guess it depends like I don't
know how many of these were

513
00:30:40,920 --> 00:30:45,360
necessarily passion projects or
Romero, because you'll see like

514
00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:49,040
after this one hits like his
next two movies, he's like, I'm

515
00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:51,440
just going to go and make what I
want and I'm going to do it.

516
00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:55,320
I'm on my own terms, even if it
means I have a lot less money.

517
00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:59,640
It feels like he was in his I
got to keep the lights on phase

518
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:03,200
and as long as like I'm getting
paid to work, like there are

519
00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:07,080
worse ways to kind of make a
living and it does.

520
00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:09,600
It's not.
There's nothing in there that

521
00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:12,560
screams like this would have
been like a real a movie that

522
00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:16,440
maybe he was super passionate
about that he wanted to see.

523
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:19,800
That's just like the way that
industry works sometimes.

524
00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:22,600
Yeah, I mean, you even hear like
Martin Scorsese, what, you know,

525
00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:25,280
he announces his next movie
right after a Killers of the

526
00:31:25,280 --> 00:31:26,800
Flower Moon.
Oh, he's going to make the story

527
00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:28,080
of Jesus.
And that's like, no, I'm going

528
00:31:28,080 --> 00:31:30,480
to make Devil in the White City
that no, I'm going to make, you

529
00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:32,520
know, I'm.
Going to make a Sinatra biopic.

530
00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:35,480
Right, right.
And so it's, and I think with

531
00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:37,400
him, he's like, I don't have
that many years left.

532
00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:40,360
I better make something that I
really really want to make.

533
00:31:40,520 --> 00:31:46,480
Or, you know, Tarantino writing,
you know, shelving the hateful 8

534
00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:49,800
the script leaked and then it
was going to be the the movie

535
00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:52,720
critic and now that's shelved
and you know who?

536
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:56,120
And I, I, you know, maybe he's
getting so much in its own head

537
00:31:56,120 --> 00:32:00,120
'cause his self-imposed last
movie, right like these things

538
00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:04,320
kind of go through was going to
be like a Vince Vega, Victoria

539
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:08,000
Vega team up at one point after
Pulp Fiction.

540
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:12,400
But I the thing that does get
Romero back on track, like in I

541
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:17,280
think 97, he directs a
commercial for the video game

542
00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:21,160
Resident Evil 2, which is really
well received.

543
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:25,480
And if you've ever played
especially those early Resident

544
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:30,640
Evil games, they owe so much to,
especially Night of the Living

545
00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:35,640
Dead, like that whole slow
shuffling zombie, the Bee movie,

546
00:32:35,640 --> 00:32:37,840
like low budget movie feel to
it.

547
00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:41,640
So to get Romero to direct a
commercial was kind of a stroke

548
00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:45,640
of genius.
And then he's attached to the

549
00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:50,040
Resident Evil movie, which
listeners, you can, if you want

550
00:32:50,040 --> 00:32:53,720
to punish yourselves a little
bit, you can go back into our

551
00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:57,920
archives and we have a whole
dramatic script reading.

552
00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:02,560
I think we have it in multiple
parts cuz of various technical

553
00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:06,080
and oh gosh frankly inebriation
issues.

554
00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:09,640
That was not one of our great.
The height of COVID.

555
00:33:10,080 --> 00:33:12,400
The height of COVID.
You know what though, I might.

556
00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:15,560
Need to hunt this down.
You don't even have to hunt for

557
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:17,320
it.
It's in the episode list.

558
00:33:18,080 --> 00:33:21,160
But it was fun and we did it
with friends during COVID at a

559
00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:23,720
time when we couldn't see
anybody so.

560
00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:27,120
Yeah.
But yeah, the cast got smaller

561
00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:31,560
and smaller with each part cuz
like people just could not come

562
00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:33,800
back for it.
We need to do another script

563
00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:35,920
reading this year.
We need to do something.

564
00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:38,480
Fun.
I mean, you know, I learned so

565
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:42,240
much about Stephen King and the
making of Maximum OverDrive.

566
00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:44,680
OverDrive, we did.
Maximum King.

567
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:46,720
That was that was the my
favorite one.

568
00:33:46,720 --> 00:33:47,920
That one was so much fun.
Yeah.

569
00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:54,280
We did the Carrie Fukunagua
unused like script for it,

570
00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:55,720
chapter one.
That's right.

571
00:33:55,840 --> 00:33:59,360
Yeah, where I think Stan was a
goldfish in that version of the

572
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:01,600
script.
We did the unmade version of

573
00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:06,880
Halloween 4 where Michael Myers
was like a ghost type of deal.

574
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:10,480
I don't remember anything about
the script.

575
00:34:10,520 --> 00:34:13,480
I just remember it was a good
time.

576
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:15,159
And that's how we met Steven as
well.

577
00:34:15,159 --> 00:34:18,199
Like doing these script
readings, like we liked him so

578
00:34:18,199 --> 00:34:19,360
much.
Or like, do you just want to

579
00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:22,560
keep coming on the show?
So that was a lot of fun.

580
00:34:22,920 --> 00:34:27,760
But he gets attached to Resident
Evil and he writes a script

581
00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:30,520
that's faithful to the game.
Like, it's not like I will

582
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:33,679
adapt, make Resident Evil fit
into the Living Dead series.

583
00:34:33,679 --> 00:34:37,199
He's like, no, he creates
something that is like fairly

584
00:34:37,199 --> 00:34:40,920
fairly faithful to to the game
itself.

585
00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:44,320
That first one, like it takes
place in Raccoon City.

586
00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:47,840
There's like the mansion,
there's the strike force team

587
00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:50,920
that's about others, like the
liquors, like the long tongued

588
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:54,360
monsters in it.
And it isn't production for over

589
00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:57,360
a year.
But then the plug is like pulled

590
00:34:57,360 --> 00:35:01,240
on the movie at that time and
Romero is let go from it.

591
00:35:01,240 --> 00:35:04,440
But all of a sudden, you know
that is something that said,

592
00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:07,240
well, why isn't Romero making
this?

593
00:35:07,240 --> 00:35:10,760
And also like, why isn't he
making movies at all?

594
00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:14,680
Like he has three classic zombie
films and he did Creepshow.

595
00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:17,600
We this guy needs to be making
movies again.

596
00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:21,680
Why is he in director jail?
And then as this is going on,

597
00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:26,320
like not too long after it, he
does turn in a script for Land

598
00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:29,560
of the Dead, which at the time,
I think it might have been

599
00:35:29,560 --> 00:35:32,200
Warner Brothers at 1st and then
eventually Universal.

600
00:35:32,520 --> 00:35:34,840
They wanted to name it Night of
the Living Dead.

601
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:36,800
They're like, well, let's just
call it that.

602
00:35:37,240 --> 00:35:39,680
And Romero's like, that's a
horrible idea.

603
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:42,640
I don't want to do that.
And if you do, I just won't do

604
00:35:42,640 --> 00:35:44,520
it.
What I do want to do is call it

605
00:35:44,520 --> 00:35:46,080
Dead Wreck.
Right.

606
00:35:46,720 --> 00:35:50,720
Which is also a really bad idea.
And they're like, no, George,

607
00:35:50,720 --> 00:35:53,480
you're not doing that.
So they compromise with Land of

608
00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:59,160
the Dead as the title, and then
911 happens and studio

609
00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:03,080
executives see this movie where
at the climax of the film,

610
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:06,480
somebody basically slings a
bunch of missiles at a

611
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:08,840
skyscraper and a lot of
civilians die.

612
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:13,000
And they're like, you know,
maybe this is not the right time

613
00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:16,760
to make this movie.
And Romero has said studios only

614
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:20,720
wanted to make touchy feely feel
good movies that something like

615
00:36:20,720 --> 00:36:26,160
this just wasn't going to land.
So the script gets shelved and

616
00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:32,360
it's not until 2004 when, you
know, we enter the conflict with

617
00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:36,240
Iraq.
And that's deeply unpopular that

618
00:36:36,240 --> 00:36:40,160
studios feel like there's enough
sentiment there for this kind of

619
00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:44,600
anti war message to resonate
with audiences.

620
00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:48,040
But something else happens in
between that and that is the

621
00:36:48,360 --> 00:36:51,280
zombie resurgence.
And I'm going to turn it over to

622
00:36:51,280 --> 00:36:55,000
you, Sarah and Brian, to talk
about a few movies that kind of

623
00:36:55,000 --> 00:37:01,720
came out between O1 and O5 that
made audiences a bit hungry for

624
00:37:02,240 --> 00:37:04,720
Land of the Dead.
Well, I mean, I mean talking

625
00:37:04,720 --> 00:37:07,720
about kind of like 911, I think
that one film in particular

626
00:37:07,720 --> 00:37:10,520
that's very fascinating in the
context of that is 28 Days

627
00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:14,400
Later, because it started
production before.

628
00:37:14,400 --> 00:37:17,920
And I think I think 911 happened
kind of about halfway through

629
00:37:17,920 --> 00:37:20,160
production and then it's
released afterwards.

630
00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:23,280
So it's this weird kind of thing
where a lot of people very much

631
00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:28,160
like it tapped into a lot of the
fear and anxiety of Post 911.

632
00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:29,720
But it was being made before
then.

633
00:37:29,720 --> 00:37:31,360
And it is interesting because
you wouldn't.

634
00:37:31,360 --> 00:37:34,240
There's a lot of the stuff in
that early part of the film

635
00:37:34,240 --> 00:37:38,680
that's so iconic with Jim
walking around the abandoned

636
00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:41,360
London.
They would not have been able to

637
00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:44,000
film that post 911.
Like it would have been

638
00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:46,240
impossible.
Like there is no way that you

639
00:37:46,240 --> 00:37:47,480
could.
They would have been able to

640
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:51,520
clear like the road outside of
Downing St. for I think it was

641
00:37:51,800 --> 00:37:54,520
20 minutes or so when they did
the scene with the bus on its

642
00:37:54,520 --> 00:37:56,480
side.
Like impossible.

643
00:37:56,480 --> 00:37:58,400
That would have been just
absolutely impossible.

644
00:37:58,440 --> 00:38:02,760
Well, just some of the imagery,
too, which if you recall, like,

645
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:06,760
New York Ground Zero at the
time, like those same memorials

646
00:38:06,760 --> 00:38:10,000
are up, like persons that were
missing and all of those

647
00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:12,480
memorials.
And my understanding is like

648
00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:16,280
Boyle says, no, we filmed all
that before 911.

649
00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:18,520
Like there's no way we would
have been able to get away with

650
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:21,760
that after the fact.
Yes, No, I think he said that he

651
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:25,600
took the inspiration for that
from a earthquake in China.

652
00:38:27,120 --> 00:38:30,320
I think that was like the direct
like inspiration for that sort

653
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:35,200
of like board of photos and
messages that was in like a

654
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:36,320
dilly circus.
Yeah.

655
00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:39,760
So I I and and of course, you
know, the whole zombies versus

656
00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:44,000
infected thing, but it does kind
of really bring to the masses

657
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:47,960
the fast zombie, which
definitely some would say really

658
00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:52,800
kicks things up a notch.
But then then then you also have

659
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:55,840
Shaun of the Dead, which, you
know, very, very more

660
00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:59,840
traditionally Romero derived.
Yeah.

661
00:38:59,960 --> 00:39:03,720
And very, you know, it's, it's,
it's, it's good because it, it

662
00:39:03,720 --> 00:39:08,360
has that kind of balance of
horror and humor, which I think

663
00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:11,840
in Romero's Dead trilogy,
particularly in Dawn, you know,

664
00:39:11,840 --> 00:39:13,960
it's, it's, it's in there.
You do have like the really

665
00:39:13,960 --> 00:39:15,480
funny moments.
And then you also have the

666
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:19,640
moments that are like, shit, I
mean, the best kind of wait,

667
00:39:19,640 --> 00:39:22,880
sorry.
I wanted to say, but my favorite

668
00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:26,840
thing about Shaun of the Dead is
that it not only sort of

669
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:30,840
captures the I mean, the gore is
like Day of the Dead level

670
00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:32,560
stuff.
I mean you have.

671
00:39:32,720 --> 00:39:36,320
People ripped.
Apart, you know, kind of things,

672
00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:39,240
yeah.
But then you also have, like you

673
00:39:39,240 --> 00:39:41,760
said, the humor.
I think the humor is even, you

674
00:39:41,760 --> 00:39:45,000
know, beyond the humor of of of
Dawn.

675
00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:50,360
But where I think it really
captures the spirit of Ramiros

676
00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:53,160
is in it's just social
commentary.

677
00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:59,160
It's basically saying these
doofuses don't even realize that

678
00:39:59,160 --> 00:40:01,760
anything is happening because
they are the zombies.

679
00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:06,160
They are the actual zombies.
We are the actual zombies and

680
00:40:06,200 --> 00:40:09,360
everything that's going on
around us, we're oblivious to it

681
00:40:09,520 --> 00:40:12,760
now.
I mean, that's and that's really

682
00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:16,480
funny though too.
And that is, but ultimately, you

683
00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:20,120
know, coming down to and then
the exploitation of the zombies

684
00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:23,400
at the end.
I think it's 100% brought into

685
00:40:23,400 --> 00:40:25,760
this movie.
And I don't know if that was

686
00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:27,760
totally.
I don't know if that was, you

687
00:40:27,760 --> 00:40:30,520
know, Ramiro saw Shaun of the
Dead, which I know he was a fan

688
00:40:30,520 --> 00:40:35,800
of, and said, hey, let's do some
of that, you know, or if it was

689
00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:39,520
if he already had that in mind.
There's definitely a thing where

690
00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:42,960
Edgar Wright said that he talked
to Romero post Shaun of the

691
00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:45,240
Dead, and he said, oh, what do
you think of the bit where we

692
00:40:45,240 --> 00:40:47,840
quoted Night and apparently
Romero was just so into the

693
00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:50,520
movie he completely missed the
fact that they quoted.

694
00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:52,400
They're coming to get old.
We're coming to.

695
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:53,720
Get you, Barbara?
Yeah.

696
00:40:55,160 --> 00:40:56,560
He was like, oh, I didn't even
know it's that.

697
00:40:56,880 --> 00:41:00,240
Yeah, it's it's brilliant.
It's probably at the top of my

698
00:41:00,240 --> 00:41:05,080
favorite, like zombie films
period, because it is so funny,

699
00:41:05,080 --> 00:41:08,840
but it doesn't sacrifice the
horror and it doesn't play the

700
00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:11,320
situation light.
No, no, it doesn't.

701
00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:15,200
You know, it's a very serious
situation with very funny bits.

702
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:19,320
And to your point, Brian, I
think my favorite scenes in the

703
00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:23,600
film are like, you have the
opening scene with Sean kind of

704
00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:28,040
moseying to the corner store to
get a, you know, to get like his

705
00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:31,000
morning soft drink and an ice
cream.

706
00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:35,160
And then the same thing happens
the next day in the same way,

707
00:41:35,160 --> 00:41:37,480
but with zombies.
And he's completely out of it

708
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:39,480
and it's live.
With a stadium, Yeah, yeah.

709
00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:41,880
Honestly, that whole kind of
like those two things side by

710
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:44,680
side I think are just genius
basically.

711
00:41:44,720 --> 00:41:46,840
Genius.
Cinema, but I mean like the mood

712
00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:50,400
of it.
You go from hitting the pub

713
00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:54,240
landlord with pool cues to Queen
and then you go into the scene

714
00:41:54,240 --> 00:41:58,720
with like Sean's mom and it's
like genuinely gut punched, like

715
00:41:58,720 --> 00:42:03,280
devastating.
It's it's just brilliant.

716
00:42:18,720 --> 00:42:23,320
Yeah.
Well, Speaking of Dawn of the

717
00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:28,920
Dead, you know, in the wake of
28 Years, 28 Days Later, you

718
00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:32,280
know, we get A and it's the
early days of the horror

719
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:34,720
remakes.
Like it's think Texas Chainsaw

720
00:42:34,720 --> 00:42:37,840
Massacre.
It happened the year before.

721
00:42:38,080 --> 00:42:42,320
So this is kind of like in those
early, early days where you have

722
00:42:42,720 --> 00:42:47,200
Zack Snyder's like, debut
feature film Dawn of the Dead,

723
00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:50,880
which keeps the setting of them
all.

724
00:42:51,760 --> 00:42:55,680
And that's really about it.
Like, it's a vastly different

725
00:42:55,680 --> 00:42:58,000
movie.
I think it's probably Snyder's

726
00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:00,800
best film.
Like, I'm not a huge Zack Snyder

727
00:43:00,800 --> 00:43:03,600
person, you know, my
understanding is people love to

728
00:43:03,600 --> 00:43:07,320
work with him.
Like, he's a very good guy to

729
00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:11,800
work with.
So his films just decidedly

730
00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:17,560
aren't necessarily for me.
Like there's a you get to 300

731
00:43:17,560 --> 00:43:21,480
and sucker punch and there's
like a hyper violent masculine

732
00:43:21,480 --> 00:43:25,600
male fantasy thing going on.
And you know, my understand is a

733
00:43:25,600 --> 00:43:29,040
guy that will do push ups
everyday while yelling kind of

734
00:43:29,040 --> 00:43:33,760
mantras to himself really loud
and God love him if that's your

735
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:36,040
thing.
But it doesn't translate.

736
00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:40,200
But dawn of the dead.
I remember seeing that in

737
00:43:40,200 --> 00:43:44,880
theaters in getting up in like,
applauding at the zombie baby,

738
00:43:44,880 --> 00:43:47,800
like the row of people I were
with, like all my friends are

739
00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:51,840
like, this is amazing.
Like, why would we not want

740
00:43:51,840 --> 00:43:55,480
this?
But that seems to be the final

741
00:43:55,640 --> 00:43:59,080
kind of cog in the wheel that
gets Land of the Dead greenlit,

742
00:43:59,080 --> 00:44:01,440
right, I think.
So this is true, and I mean oh

743
00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:05,040
boy will I go into it when we
get to the Zack Snyder Day of

744
00:44:05,080 --> 00:44:07,280
Dead.
So it is not your thing for

745
00:44:07,280 --> 00:44:10,800
sure.
It's it's not, I don't hate it.

746
00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:15,400
And like I have, I've like
watched both cuts of the film.

747
00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:20,320
I have seen it multiple times,
like, like I have tried with

748
00:44:20,600 --> 00:44:23,520
Zack Snyder's John the Dead, but
I can never get away from the

749
00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:27,560
fact that it is just such a
stupid fucking movie.

750
00:44:28,480 --> 00:44:31,800
Like it just like the opening
sort of 10 minutes.

751
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:33,880
It's like, yeah, that's very
cool, very intense.

752
00:44:33,880 --> 00:44:36,320
And then got Johnny Cash, love a
bit of Johnny Cash.

753
00:44:36,320 --> 00:44:43,080
But after that it is just a
non-stop parade of people being

754
00:44:43,080 --> 00:44:46,840
absolute fucking idiots.
And there just comes a point

755
00:44:46,840 --> 00:44:49,440
where I'm just like, I'm done
with you.

756
00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:52,600
And I think, I mean, I have a
like theories about it because

757
00:44:52,600 --> 00:44:54,560
of course it was written by
James Gunn.

758
00:44:54,560 --> 00:45:01,120
And so I I just, I wonder how
much James Gunn wrote it as

759
00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:03,920
comedic and then Zack Snyder
directed it.

760
00:45:04,440 --> 00:45:06,720
Straight.
Kind of thing.

761
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:11,560
With like again, like just a
blunt force drama going into it.

762
00:45:12,200 --> 00:45:14,960
And but I will say there are
things I like in it.

763
00:45:14,960 --> 00:45:19,120
I think that the it's it's very
much a remake in name only in my

764
00:45:19,120 --> 00:45:21,480
opinion.
I don't think it takes like it.

765
00:45:21,480 --> 00:45:23,680
Sure, it has the mall setting,
but I don't think it takes

766
00:45:23,680 --> 00:45:26,600
advantage of the mall setting in
the same way that the original

767
00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:30,320
does.
And yeah, just everyone in it is

768
00:45:30,320 --> 00:45:35,960
just so freaking stupid.
I definitely can't wait to talk

769
00:45:35,960 --> 00:45:40,520
about the end of that movie
because it's one of the things I

770
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:44,640
hate when a horror like, you've
spent close to two hours rooting

771
00:45:44,640 --> 00:45:48,080
for these people and then like
during the end credits, like

772
00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:51,880
their plan to escape is like,
sure, but now we're going to

773
00:45:51,880 --> 00:45:54,600
have them like, devoured in 30
seconds.

774
00:45:54,600 --> 00:45:58,240
And it's kind of like, well,
what did I just spend the last

775
00:45:58,240 --> 00:46:01,720
two hours doing here then?
Like that's the kind of thing it

776
00:46:01,760 --> 00:46:04,880
felt very like the end feels
very cheap to me.

777
00:46:05,040 --> 00:46:08,280
If you're gonna have a bleak
ending, go all in on the bleak

778
00:46:08,280 --> 00:46:12,440
ending and not just tack it on
to the ending yet to the credits

779
00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:15,280
or whatever.
Yeah, I'm, I'm kind of think

780
00:46:15,360 --> 00:46:17,120
more with you, Sarah, on that
one.

781
00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:21,960
I've seen it twice because I
read Ariel's book and she talks

782
00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:24,360
about the Dawn of the Dead
remake in it.

783
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:28,240
And I was just like, OK, you've
convinced me to watch this

784
00:46:28,240 --> 00:46:30,120
again.
And I did.

785
00:46:30,640 --> 00:46:34,920
And it was just kind of like, it
doesn't do that much for me.

786
00:46:35,160 --> 00:46:39,520
It's I, I like parts of it too.
I, I mean, I wish that I, I

787
00:46:39,520 --> 00:46:44,080
think a lot of it is I just see
and I know that there is a

788
00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:49,000
school of thought about, you
know, style being the substance,

789
00:46:50,120 --> 00:46:52,680
but I feel like that is all that
is there.

790
00:46:52,680 --> 00:46:54,600
It is slick.
Yeah, it's not saying.

791
00:46:54,600 --> 00:46:58,400
Pretty and has nothing behind
its eyes, it is saying.

792
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:02,160
I agree.
Great big beautiful zombie of a

793
00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:06,760
picture.
Yeah, I rewatched it recently.

794
00:47:06,760 --> 00:47:10,400
Like as we started this series,
like I've gone ahead and just

795
00:47:10,400 --> 00:47:14,760
rewatched a bunch of zombie
films I really like and I still

796
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:17,360
really enjoyed it.
Like I found it like to your

797
00:47:17,360 --> 00:47:21,000
point, Brian, it's like and said
there's nothing there and people

798
00:47:21,000 --> 00:47:25,160
act horrible and people act
stupid and the reason they leave

799
00:47:25,160 --> 00:47:27,720
the mall is I still can't really
comprehend it.

800
00:47:27,720 --> 00:47:29,480
There isn't.
One that this is.

801
00:47:29,480 --> 00:47:31,440
Sorry, this is.
Just like one of my biggest pet

802
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:34,640
peeves, that movie.
There is no good reason for them

803
00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:37,640
to leave that mall.
And they don't even like fortify

804
00:47:37,640 --> 00:47:40,080
that mall or anything.
They're just like, oh, we've

805
00:47:40,080 --> 00:47:41,320
locked the doors.
That's good enough.

806
00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:45,800
Yeah, but is a way to kill a
couple hours with some good

807
00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:48,520
effects and I don't know, I was
down with the sickness.

808
00:47:48,520 --> 00:47:51,800
It's all on.
I like the references to it in

809
00:47:51,800 --> 00:47:55,240
The 40 Year Old Virgin.
You know where he's watching.

810
00:47:55,240 --> 00:47:56,360
Watch.
That in forever.

811
00:47:56,360 --> 00:48:00,080
Or he's the guys watching it in.
This in the electronic store is

812
00:48:00,080 --> 00:48:02,320
pretty funny.
I have not watched Polar just

813
00:48:02,480 --> 00:48:04,280
forever.
Yeah, so anyway.

814
00:48:04,560 --> 00:48:06,960
Well, talk a little bit about
the casting here.

815
00:48:06,960 --> 00:48:11,800
Like it is a mix of established
and up and comers like Romero

816
00:48:12,120 --> 00:48:14,840
for the first time, Like he
actually has like a real budget

817
00:48:14,840 --> 00:48:18,040
to play with.
Like he's about $15 million and

818
00:48:18,040 --> 00:48:21,680
he gets like Dennis Hopper to
come in as like the big bad in

819
00:48:21,680 --> 00:48:23,960
this.
And Dennis Hopper, kid kind of

820
00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:28,720
gone from one of the real wild
men of New Hollywood with things

821
00:48:28,720 --> 00:48:32,480
like Easy Rider and Last Picture
Show and had been like

822
00:48:32,480 --> 00:48:36,400
unemployable for like a huge
stretch of time just because of

823
00:48:36,400 --> 00:48:39,560
so many substance issues and
being hard to work with by this

824
00:48:39,560 --> 00:48:41,920
point.
Like one of the few kind of

825
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:44,560
mainstream conservatives in
Hollywood.

826
00:48:44,840 --> 00:48:45,640
It's just insane.
To me.

827
00:48:46,640 --> 00:48:47,920
It's really is.
It's.

828
00:48:47,920 --> 00:48:53,080
Wild because I mean, he was the
epitome of the new left in the

829
00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:55,960
yeah, in in the, you know, an
Easy Rider and stuff.

830
00:48:55,960 --> 00:49:00,840
He was the cowboy.
He was, you know, so it was just

831
00:49:00,840 --> 00:49:02,920
wild to me.
And, you know, I mean, but I got

832
00:49:02,920 --> 00:49:06,600
to say dude can act.
I mean to Oh yeah, playing the

833
00:49:06,600 --> 00:49:11,760
cowboy, playing, you know, like
Frank Booth in Blue Velvet and

834
00:49:11,760 --> 00:49:16,760
then, you know, the terrorist in
speed and, you know, it's just,

835
00:49:16,760 --> 00:49:19,640
there's just so much that he is
capable of.

836
00:49:19,640 --> 00:49:21,480
And in this movie, he's he's
terrific.

837
00:49:21,720 --> 00:49:24,240
It's a very he's not in it that
much.

838
00:49:24,240 --> 00:49:28,640
I mean, he's, he's, he's a
glorified cameo in a lot of

839
00:49:28,640 --> 00:49:29,400
ways.
He's probably.

840
00:49:29,400 --> 00:49:32,080
Very ill by then too.
I think he said not long after

841
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:33,520
this they announced that he's
I'll.

842
00:49:33,600 --> 00:49:37,400
Yeah, he talks about he played
the role like Donald Rumsfeld.

843
00:49:37,400 --> 00:49:40,720
It's basically what I've read is
that he's trying to channel

844
00:49:40,720 --> 00:49:44,560
Donald Rumsfeld and like that
kind of like power player in

845
00:49:44,560 --> 00:49:47,720
Hollywood.
But you know, then in interviews

846
00:49:47,720 --> 00:49:51,280
he would say, but, you know, I'm
not playing like a Republicans.

847
00:49:51,280 --> 00:49:54,600
I don't think Republicans are
really all that evil.

848
00:49:54,600 --> 00:49:56,680
And it's like, you're so close
to this.

849
00:49:56,720 --> 00:50:01,600
You're so close to getting it.
And that's what's fascinating is

850
00:50:01,600 --> 00:50:03,720
that someone like Hopper comes
in.

851
00:50:04,160 --> 00:50:06,040
He really wanted to work with
Romero.

852
00:50:06,040 --> 00:50:09,280
Like, he had a lot of respect
for Night of the Living Dead and

853
00:50:09,280 --> 00:50:13,040
Dawn of the Dead in particular.
And he was really excited to

854
00:50:13,040 --> 00:50:17,960
work with Romero.
And to me, you get someone who

855
00:50:18,760 --> 00:50:23,680
knows this filmmaker, knows what
this guy's movies are all about

856
00:50:23,680 --> 00:50:27,720
and the message underneath it,
but doesn't recognize, like, I'm

857
00:50:27,720 --> 00:50:30,640
the bad guy here.
Like, and I'm the bad guy

858
00:50:30,640 --> 00:50:35,160
because of these ultra
capitalist beliefs and these,

859
00:50:35,600 --> 00:50:39,000
you know, basically feeding
people to the gristle of the

860
00:50:39,000 --> 00:50:41,600
machine.
And he's like, yeah, but I don't

861
00:50:41,600 --> 00:50:45,560
really, I don't really see the
political context there.

862
00:50:45,560 --> 00:50:48,520
Like that is a next level of.
He's literally.

863
00:50:48,680 --> 00:50:51,880
Of dissonance.
He's literally dressed like Dick

864
00:50:51,960 --> 00:50:54,360
Dick Cheney in the movie.
Yeah, yeah.

865
00:50:55,200 --> 00:50:58,520
It's hard to miss.
It's not subtle.

866
00:50:58,840 --> 00:51:02,840
John Leguizamo would have been
the other kind of notable talent

867
00:51:02,840 --> 00:51:04,880
who had done things like Romeo
and Juliet.

868
00:51:05,160 --> 00:51:08,760
Son of Sam, Spawn, you know the
past.

869
00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:14,480
He's gone, yeah, but he's just a
a tremendous kind of chameleon

870
00:51:14,480 --> 00:51:16,360
of an actor like he.
I always.

871
00:51:16,440 --> 00:51:17,480
Forget he's in.
Spawn.

872
00:51:18,040 --> 00:51:22,880
Yeah, I always forget Clown.
Yeah, he's one of those guys

873
00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:26,560
that, like, you don't
necessarily think a ton of.

874
00:51:26,920 --> 00:51:29,960
And then he's great.
Like, you know, almost.

875
00:51:29,960 --> 00:51:33,880
He's in Carlito's way.
He's Luigi in Super Mario

876
00:51:33,880 --> 00:51:40,080
Brothers, which OK.
That's a movie.

877
00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:44,800
He and then he would like go on
to like anchor things like the

878
00:51:44,800 --> 00:51:48,880
Ice Age animated films.
That's probably what he's best

879
00:51:48,960 --> 00:51:52,520
known for at this point.
Well, he's in tremendous and.

880
00:51:52,520 --> 00:51:55,600
He's in Violent Night.
He's essentially playing a

881
00:51:55,640 --> 00:51:58,160
similar character that plays in
this movie.

882
00:51:58,560 --> 00:52:02,000
That's a good point in Violent
Night, but he's great in that

883
00:52:02,000 --> 00:52:02,760
he's.
The menu.

884
00:52:03,440 --> 00:52:07,520
Oh, that's right, I forgot.
Jeez, he's great at the menu.

885
00:52:07,520 --> 00:52:09,200
I love him.
I really like that movie.

886
00:52:09,440 --> 00:52:10,640
Yeah, me too.
I kind of.

887
00:52:10,640 --> 00:52:14,000
Feel like he's an under
appreciated performer.

888
00:52:14,200 --> 00:52:18,720
I've always really liked him.
I remember seeing him on, gosh,

889
00:52:18,720 --> 00:52:20,320
I don't even remember what it
was like.

890
00:52:20,320 --> 00:52:24,760
A short lived sketch show that
came out around the in living

891
00:52:24,760 --> 00:52:28,920
color time of things, and it was
it was his show.

892
00:52:28,920 --> 00:52:31,720
It's like, hi, I'm John
Leguizamo and this is this is

893
00:52:31,720 --> 00:52:34,000
our this is what we got for you.
And it was like a sketch show.

894
00:52:34,000 --> 00:52:37,040
I don't even remember what it
was, but it was.

895
00:52:37,120 --> 00:52:38,880
So that's where I first remember
seeing him.

896
00:52:38,880 --> 00:52:41,960
And then, you know, he showed.
Then there's, you know, to Wong

897
00:52:41,960 --> 00:52:43,160
Foo.
Thanks for everything, Julie

898
00:52:43,160 --> 00:52:45,480
Newmar.
And it's like, wow, that's the

899
00:52:45,480 --> 00:52:47,600
same guy.
That's what a great performance.

900
00:52:47,960 --> 00:52:50,480
And then, you know, just
everything he's in.

901
00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:53,120
I think he's fantastic.
Yeah, I'd agree.

902
00:52:53,240 --> 00:52:55,520
Yeah, I would agree.
Yeah, I think first thing for me

903
00:52:55,520 --> 00:52:59,480
was definitely Romeo and Julia
kind of thing.

904
00:52:59,480 --> 00:53:05,400
Although he was also in a failed
attempt to remake the British

905
00:53:05,400 --> 00:53:08,160
sitcom Only Fools and Horses.
There's like.

906
00:53:08,160 --> 00:53:11,960
I'm not familiar with that.
It's it's like the premises like

907
00:53:11,960 --> 00:53:15,440
these is like two brothers who
are kind of like a bit of sort

908
00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:17,880
of like Wheeler dealers.
They're always trying to get

909
00:53:18,360 --> 00:53:20,800
like a get rich quick scheme
kind of thing.

910
00:53:20,800 --> 00:53:22,720
And or it's saying, oh, this
time next year we'll be

911
00:53:22,720 --> 00:53:24,640
millionaires.
But yeah, there was an attempt

912
00:53:24,640 --> 00:53:30,600
to do an American remake of it.
And yeah, John Leguizamo was in

913
00:53:30,600 --> 00:53:34,000
that as kind of like the the
main role that in the British

914
00:53:34,000 --> 00:53:36,800
show is called Del Boy.
It's kind of, it's kind of like

915
00:53:36,800 --> 00:53:38,680
one of the classic British
sitcoms.

916
00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:43,960
OK, like a Fawlty Towers and.
Oh yeah, yeah, that that kind of

917
00:53:43,960 --> 00:53:45,040
thing.
Like there's there's.

918
00:53:45,080 --> 00:53:48,520
Father Ted.
Oh yeah, yeah, it's it's so it's

919
00:53:48,880 --> 00:53:53,280
older than Father Ted, but yeah.
OK, so in the main role, we have

920
00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:58,320
Dylan Baker, who up and Comer at
the time, probably best known

921
00:53:58,720 --> 00:54:04,280
for starring in the CBS drama
The Mentalist, which is one of

922
00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:10,160
those shows that exists because,
like, Jim's Need shows to play

923
00:54:10,160 --> 00:54:12,560
in the background at 2:00 in the
afternoon.

924
00:54:12,560 --> 00:54:16,360
And you can just make these
things cheap and forever.

925
00:54:16,800 --> 00:54:22,560
And he's probably a very rich
man for playing a role on a show

926
00:54:22,800 --> 00:54:27,120
that I don't know a single
person who's ever, like, watched

927
00:54:27,120 --> 00:54:28,520
and followed.
You know, it's one of those

928
00:54:28,520 --> 00:54:33,080
shows that, yeah, it's like, no
one is out there.

929
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:34,800
Yeah.
It's not like we have a show

930
00:54:34,800 --> 00:54:39,720
like Firefly that runs for like
13 episodes and people go Gaga

931
00:54:39,960 --> 00:54:42,280
for it.
Like there's no mentalist stands

932
00:54:42,280 --> 00:54:44,720
out there.
There's not like or Supernatural

933
00:54:44,720 --> 00:54:48,120
where those two guys could, you
know, that cast could live off

934
00:54:48,120 --> 00:54:50,840
the convention circuit forever
if they ever needed to.

935
00:54:51,240 --> 00:54:55,680
No one is ever going to be like,
hey, mentalist convention, it's

936
00:54:55,680 --> 00:54:58,320
going down.
Let's book our tickets and

937
00:54:58,320 --> 00:54:59,400
flight.
You know what I mean?

938
00:54:59,400 --> 00:55:01,680
Like, that's not going to
happen.

939
00:55:02,040 --> 00:55:06,720
But he's he's all right.
Asia Argento is brought on cast.

940
00:55:06,720 --> 00:55:10,960
She's the daughter of Italian
horror maestro Dario Argento.

941
00:55:11,320 --> 00:55:14,440
And it is really complicated to
talk about her.

942
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:19,400
Like, she is someone who has had
a very storied career, mostly

943
00:55:19,400 --> 00:55:23,880
overseas, but that she has also
been like a victim of and a

944
00:55:23,880 --> 00:55:28,800
perpetrator of some pretty bad
sexual abuse.

945
00:55:28,800 --> 00:55:32,280
And I don't know how much we
want to dive into that here.

946
00:55:32,280 --> 00:55:36,360
Maybe not much except to say
that like it horrible things

947
00:55:36,360 --> 00:55:40,760
happen to her and hurt people
often go on to hurt other

948
00:55:40,760 --> 00:55:45,320
people.
So and I have no jokes for once

949
00:55:45,320 --> 00:55:47,000
I have like.
Yeah, no jokes.

950
00:55:47,000 --> 00:55:49,840
It's not really, anyway.
It's fun.

951
00:55:49,840 --> 00:55:52,840
It's one of those things where
it's like with me, I kind of

952
00:55:53,040 --> 00:55:58,600
like I said, there's sort of
this big gap in my sort of

953
00:55:58,640 --> 00:56:04,280
horror film knowledge where I
was on, you know, I was engaged

954
00:56:04,280 --> 00:56:09,600
with what was going on.
So I hear about actually Argento

955
00:56:09,600 --> 00:56:12,640
and I'm like, and people will
say, but you know, we're, we're

956
00:56:12,640 --> 00:56:13,800
not.
And, and they'll just sort of

957
00:56:13,800 --> 00:56:15,680
skirt around the subject and
just move on.

958
00:56:16,080 --> 00:56:20,880
And I'm like, I have no idea.
I, I I I'm completely clueless

959
00:56:21,160 --> 00:56:23,240
about.
So essentially like she's one of

960
00:56:23,240 --> 00:56:26,560
the many victims of Harvey
Weinstein for sure.

961
00:56:26,600 --> 00:56:28,200
OK.
Like that is one of the things

962
00:56:28,200 --> 00:56:30,840
is that she was assaulted
repeatedly by him.

963
00:56:30,840 --> 00:56:35,440
But then when she spoke out
against it, one of, like, a

964
00:56:35,520 --> 00:56:38,560
young male performer who was,
like, underage at the time said,

965
00:56:38,560 --> 00:56:41,440
hey, she took advantage of me
sexually.

966
00:56:41,440 --> 00:56:43,760
And she was with Anthony
Bourdain at the time.

967
00:56:43,760 --> 00:56:47,160
And she was very adamant that
this had not happened.

968
00:56:47,160 --> 00:56:50,600
Like, this is a lie.
They're trying to sully my name.

969
00:56:50,840 --> 00:56:54,360
But he had receipts.
And there were like a number of

970
00:56:54,360 --> 00:56:58,720
like, text messages and a photo
of them in bed together and some

971
00:56:59,160 --> 00:57:03,320
text messages that she had sent
that were pretty explicit at

972
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:06,600
admitting it as well.
So or admitting some level of

973
00:57:06,600 --> 00:57:10,320
wrongdoing as well.
And it was, I feel like she

974
00:57:10,320 --> 00:57:14,600
almost tried to Bill Clinton her
way out of it where, you know,

975
00:57:14,600 --> 00:57:18,200
famously he said I did not have
sexual relations with that

976
00:57:18,200 --> 00:57:20,120
woman.
And it came down to like, well,

977
00:57:20,120 --> 00:57:24,640
how do you define sexual
relation type of deal, you know?

978
00:57:24,680 --> 00:57:26,520
Depends on what the meaning of
the is.

979
00:57:28,400 --> 00:57:31,640
OK, and it doesn't mean that she
was any less of a victim as

980
00:57:31,640 --> 00:57:35,560
well, but also that like she
also perpetrated some awful

981
00:57:35,560 --> 00:57:37,800
things.
And it was also weird that her

982
00:57:37,800 --> 00:57:41,320
dad would film her naked in some
of his movies as well.

983
00:57:41,320 --> 00:57:46,680
Like that cannot be good for
anyone's mental well-being.

984
00:57:46,680 --> 00:57:49,840
That's was just weird.
So we'll be gone.

985
00:57:49,880 --> 00:57:50,240
Yeah.
Sorry.

986
00:57:50,240 --> 00:57:52,440
Sorry to open that.
Down.

987
00:57:52,440 --> 00:57:56,040
No worries, I think it fares.
Probably just about it.

988
00:57:57,520 --> 00:58:00,080
I'll probably put a little
disclaimer at the top of the

989
00:58:00,080 --> 00:58:01,040
episode.
Sure.

990
00:58:01,040 --> 00:58:04,240
For the ABUSA kids, Simon Pegg
and Edgar Wright, in a more

991
00:58:04,240 --> 00:58:09,480
delightful note, do make cameos
as zombies in this movie.

992
00:58:09,480 --> 00:58:13,720
Like they are the 2 zombies in
the kind of photo booth scene.

993
00:58:13,720 --> 00:58:16,160
I love that.
If you believe the rumors.

994
00:58:16,160 --> 00:58:19,880
Like Edgar Wright is supposed to
be Bub from Dawn.

995
00:58:20,200 --> 00:58:24,080
Sorry Day of the Dead, I don't
necessarily buy that, but he is

996
00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:28,200
made-up in a similar way.
Maybe isn't nod to that, but I

997
00:58:28,200 --> 00:58:30,760
don't necessarily buy.
Oh, that's what he's supposed to

998
00:58:30,760 --> 00:58:33,160
be, yeah.
I don't like that at all.

999
00:58:34,040 --> 00:58:36,600
Yeah.
So the movie's a hit.

1000
00:58:36,600 --> 00:58:41,920
It is released in June of O5,
pulls in close to $50 million

1001
00:58:42,280 --> 00:58:45,960
worldwide, triples its budget.
Not bad at all.

1002
00:58:45,960 --> 00:58:48,240
I think maybe they were
expecting a little bit more

1003
00:58:48,240 --> 00:58:52,800
given that it was Romero
returning to the series that

1004
00:58:52,800 --> 00:58:55,280
made him famous and zombies were
hot.

1005
00:58:55,520 --> 00:58:59,440
But it does really well and
Romero is absolutely miserable

1006
00:58:59,680 --> 00:59:03,760
making it and dealing with the
studio and decides after that,

1007
00:59:03,760 --> 00:59:06,920
like, fuck it, I am just going
to go back to independent

1008
00:59:06,920 --> 00:59:10,840
filmmaking and do my own thing.
And we'll talk more about that

1009
00:59:10,840 --> 00:59:14,880
in our next two episodes.
Let's dive into the movie for a

1010
00:59:14,880 --> 00:59:20,000
short bit, then call it a day.
So, Sarah, you have a note here

1011
00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:24,920
about Fiddler's Green as a name,
like the the main source of

1012
00:59:24,920 --> 00:59:26,480
refuge.
What can you say about?

1013
00:59:26,640 --> 00:59:29,120
That so I just I found that very
interesting kind of thing.

1014
00:59:29,120 --> 00:59:33,040
So I like the because the sort
of the rich section of kind of

1015
00:59:33,040 --> 00:59:36,440
like this, this sort of
settlement is called Fiddler's

1016
00:59:36,440 --> 00:59:43,240
Green, which traditionally in
old seafaring ballads was the

1017
00:59:43,960 --> 00:59:48,400
essentially the afterlife for
that loyal sailors would go to

1018
00:59:48,880 --> 00:59:53,640
like that would be their reward.
And it was, it's also kind of

1019
00:59:53,640 --> 00:59:57,440
thought that it was kind of like
a alternative to heaven for

1020
00:59:57,440 --> 01:00:00,400
pirates who would not typically
be allowed to go to heaven due

1021
01:00:00,400 --> 01:00:03,360
to all of the, you know.
Stealing and killing.

1022
01:00:03,360 --> 01:00:04,960
So fiddlers, green kind.
Of.

1023
01:00:05,880 --> 01:00:09,080
That's traditionally, yeah.
But yeah, so Fiddlers Green was

1024
01:00:09,080 --> 01:00:11,400
kind of like this sort of
mythical, like alternate

1025
01:00:11,400 --> 01:00:14,520
afterlife.
But then there's this other kind

1026
01:00:14,520 --> 01:00:19,880
of use of it, I think in US
Cavalry men and sort of like the

1027
01:00:20,440 --> 01:00:26,480
around kind of like the 1900s
kind of thing where where it's

1028
01:00:26,480 --> 01:00:29,680
more of a kind of purgatory.
And there's like a poem that

1029
01:00:29,680 --> 01:00:32,880
describes it as halfway down the
trail to hell.

1030
01:00:33,800 --> 01:00:38,000
And in the final verse of that
ballad is essentially kind of

1031
01:00:38,000 --> 01:00:41,960
like it.
It kind of essentially says,

1032
01:00:42,880 --> 01:00:46,160
describe someone being
surrounded by enemies and their

1033
01:00:46,160 --> 01:00:50,640
back against the wall and to put
their gun to their head and go

1034
01:00:50,640 --> 01:00:54,560
to Fiddler's Green, Which I
think which really kind of like

1035
01:00:54,560 --> 01:00:56,640
made me think of the kid at the
beginning of this movie.

1036
01:00:56,640 --> 01:00:59,560
Because like at the beginning,
the main guy, Riley and his a

1037
01:00:59,600 --> 01:01:02,360
lot of scavengers, they go out
and this young kid who's like

1038
01:01:02,360 --> 01:01:05,480
his first time out, he gets
bitten and blows his head off

1039
01:01:06,280 --> 01:01:08,760
kind of thing.
So I find like it very

1040
01:01:08,760 --> 01:01:10,720
interesting that they use the
name fiddlers Green because it's

1041
01:01:10,720 --> 01:01:15,480
very much a it's got very both
like positive and very negative

1042
01:01:16,200 --> 01:01:19,840
kind of interpretations to it.
So it which I think also really

1043
01:01:19,840 --> 01:01:22,880
reflects the fact that, you
know, this, this it looks like a

1044
01:01:22,880 --> 01:01:28,360
kind of paradise in this zombie
infested world, but really it's

1045
01:01:28,360 --> 01:01:33,840
its own kind of hell.
And I mean, kind of like the

1046
01:01:33,840 --> 01:01:37,920
whole sort of symbology of, you
know, we have the Richie Rich,

1047
01:01:37,920 --> 01:01:41,680
then we have coming people in
the surrounding area, and then

1048
01:01:41,680 --> 01:01:43,640
we have the zombies kind of
thing.

1049
01:01:43,640 --> 01:01:46,840
And the zombies kind of like
essentially rising up to take

1050
01:01:46,840 --> 01:01:50,960
out the Richie Rich people, but
then the people in the middle

1051
01:01:50,960 --> 01:01:52,520
kind of get caught in the
crossfire.

1052
01:01:53,000 --> 01:01:57,520
You feel like they are there and
they're kept around almost to be

1053
01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:03,920
like a buffer zone and nothing
else between the zombies and the

1054
01:02:03,920 --> 01:02:07,480
ultra wealthy.
That at the end of the day, I

1055
01:02:07,480 --> 01:02:10,320
think the expectation was like,
if anything were ever to go

1056
01:02:10,320 --> 01:02:15,000
down, the zombies could feast on
the poor and the rich could like

1057
01:02:15,000 --> 01:02:17,400
make their escape.
Like that was supposed to be the

1058
01:02:17,440 --> 01:02:19,640
plan.
I mean, like the whole, that

1059
01:02:19,640 --> 01:02:22,200
whole kind of like community,
even even aside from like the

1060
01:02:22,200 --> 01:02:25,160
events, the film, like there's
no way that could be sustainable

1061
01:02:25,160 --> 01:02:27,680
for much longer.
Like, this is meant to be like,

1062
01:02:28,240 --> 01:02:31,280
I'm not sure how many years
after the outbreak this is meant

1063
01:02:31,280 --> 01:02:34,120
to be, but sort of like without
any kind of like, means of

1064
01:02:34,120 --> 01:02:37,000
production for the luxury goods
they're all enjoying, Like,

1065
01:02:37,080 --> 01:02:40,840
there is no way this could like,
keep going for much longer.

1066
01:02:41,080 --> 01:02:45,520
And also the fact that, of
course, like, money, like Charlo

1067
01:02:45,520 --> 01:02:48,440
wants his money in order to be
able to buy himself into the

1068
01:02:48,440 --> 01:02:51,520
good life.
And then at the end, Kauffman is

1069
01:02:51,520 --> 01:02:53,240
making a break for it with a
whole bunch of money.

1070
01:02:53,240 --> 01:02:55,440
Money is meaningless.
Right.

1071
01:02:55,440 --> 01:02:57,840
It's like, what the hell are you
going to do with that?

1072
01:02:58,480 --> 01:03:01,440
There's no place for money in
this world anymore.

1073
01:03:01,440 --> 01:03:05,080
But they're just clinging on to
that archaic idea.

1074
01:03:06,520 --> 01:03:08,520
Yeah.
We have that one board member

1075
01:03:08,520 --> 01:03:10,800
who's like fucking pay them like
who cares?

1076
01:03:11,240 --> 01:03:14,040
Like they don't need to spend
money on anything.

1077
01:03:14,040 --> 01:03:16,520
All of their needs are taken
care of.

1078
01:03:17,160 --> 01:03:20,000
That is what what hit me re
watching this movie.

1079
01:03:21,040 --> 01:03:25,480
It made me rethink about like
COVID in 2020, in 2021 again, in

1080
01:03:25,480 --> 01:03:29,720
that there was a period during
that time, for as awful as it

1081
01:03:29,720 --> 01:03:33,720
was, there was a point where
it's like, oh, we can actually

1082
01:03:34,000 --> 01:03:35,560
do things a little bit
differently.

1083
01:03:35,560 --> 01:03:38,840
Like the way that we've been
doing things maybe isn't

1084
01:03:38,840 --> 01:03:43,160
necessarily been good for us as
a society and as individuals.

1085
01:03:43,160 --> 01:03:47,160
So the idea that like you mean I
can do, I can be just as

1086
01:03:47,160 --> 01:03:51,680
productive, if not even more so
working out of home and doing

1087
01:03:51,680 --> 01:03:55,400
the same tasks.
But I don't need to be somewhere

1088
01:03:55,400 --> 01:03:57,880
8 hours a day.
If it takes me like 4 hours to

1089
01:03:57,880 --> 01:04:01,560
do them, it takes me 4 hours,
but I can have more time for

1090
01:04:01,560 --> 01:04:03,520
myself.
I can have more time to like

1091
01:04:03,800 --> 01:04:06,280
spend with my children.
I don't have to spend an hour

1092
01:04:06,280 --> 01:04:10,160
each way in the car everyday.
And this idea that we can

1093
01:04:10,760 --> 01:04:14,960
increase the social safety net
and have tax breaks for families

1094
01:04:14,960 --> 01:04:18,200
that were not just like an end
of year break, but every month,

1095
01:04:18,200 --> 01:04:21,880
like you're getting money to
basically take care of your

1096
01:04:21,880 --> 01:04:26,240
children, which was a huge
economic and lifted, I think

1097
01:04:26,240 --> 01:04:30,120
like it lowered the child
poverty rate, but I want to say

1098
01:04:30,120 --> 01:04:33,640
at least 33% and I'm probably
off by on that number.

1099
01:04:33,640 --> 01:04:38,360
And you had families that were
like, I can afford better food

1100
01:04:38,360 --> 01:04:42,160
and the necessities for my kid.
And it takes a huge weight off

1101
01:04:42,160 --> 01:04:47,520
my back that we had like outdoor
restaurants and nicer, like

1102
01:04:47,520 --> 01:04:49,880
greener spaces.
Like there was more effort put

1103
01:04:49,880 --> 01:04:53,240
in and we could have like kept
on that trajectory.

1104
01:04:53,520 --> 01:04:59,560
But instead, there was this
absolute race to put the systems

1105
01:04:59,560 --> 01:05:03,640
back in place that we had
before, even though there's

1106
01:05:03,640 --> 01:05:07,000
almost a universal
acknowledgement those systems

1107
01:05:07,000 --> 01:05:10,880
were already failing us before
the pandemic.

1108
01:05:11,960 --> 01:05:16,160
Oh, absolutely.
And I mean, it's also like the.

1109
01:05:16,680 --> 01:05:20,560
But yeah, it was just like, like
we all got dragged into the old

1110
01:05:20,560 --> 01:05:23,280
normality like as soon as they
could.

1111
01:05:23,320 --> 01:05:27,240
And yeah, it, it kind of like,
it does go back to that thing of

1112
01:05:27,240 --> 01:05:31,840
like the people who benefited
from the old systems trying to

1113
01:05:31,840 --> 01:05:34,920
hold on to them.
Yeah, as much as possible.

1114
01:05:35,080 --> 01:05:38,600
And I mean, I said in my notes
that like, like the the people

1115
01:05:38,600 --> 01:05:41,120
in Fiddler's Green and like
this, this whole kind of like,

1116
01:05:41,440 --> 01:05:45,120
you know, big tower separate
from like the sickness and

1117
01:05:45,120 --> 01:05:46,600
things.
It's very, very Mask of Red

1118
01:05:46,600 --> 01:05:48,120
Death.
Kind of thing.

1119
01:05:48,320 --> 01:05:51,720
Yeah, it is.
But they're like so removed from

1120
01:05:51,720 --> 01:05:56,960
the zombie threat that like that
when we do see like a zombie in

1121
01:05:56,960 --> 01:05:59,800
this kind of area near the
beginning when one of the

1122
01:05:59,800 --> 01:06:03,720
residents of the tower hangs
himself and trailer goes in and

1123
01:06:03,720 --> 01:06:06,640
like the guy's wife or whatever,
like like they're completely

1124
01:06:06,640 --> 01:06:08,880
useless.
Basically they have no that

1125
01:06:08,880 --> 01:06:11,600
she's just sitting, sitting
there screaming and crying or

1126
01:06:11,600 --> 01:06:16,640
it's like zombie hello, whereas
kind of like as the people from

1127
01:06:16,640 --> 01:06:19,320
like the raiding team they would
have they would just be on it

1128
01:06:19,320 --> 01:06:21,400
like straight away.
So they're just like so removed

1129
01:06:21,400 --> 01:06:23,400
from it.
Then you have the people in the

1130
01:06:23,400 --> 01:06:28,040
outer city who it's like they're
closer to the horror, but

1131
01:06:28,040 --> 01:06:31,520
they're also just kind of like
they're kind of desensitized to

1132
01:06:31,520 --> 01:06:33,840
it because they're using it for
that entertainment that like

1133
01:06:33,840 --> 01:06:37,960
with the things like the photo
booth and the games and using

1134
01:06:37,960 --> 01:06:39,760
for paintball practice and
things.

1135
01:06:40,120 --> 01:06:44,320
So they're just kind of like,
it's like they're, they kind of

1136
01:06:44,320 --> 01:06:47,880
don't take it seriously enough
in, in their own way until it's,

1137
01:06:48,240 --> 01:06:51,240
it's kind of tearing down the
gate, so to speak.

1138
01:06:51,280 --> 01:06:53,080
Right.
Well, you with that then.

1139
01:06:53,080 --> 01:06:55,640
You mentioned like that wealthy
family in the tower, like the

1140
01:06:55,880 --> 01:07:00,160
suggestion is the people that
have the most are the least able

1141
01:07:00,160 --> 01:07:03,360
to contribute anything of value.
Absolutely.

1142
01:07:03,360 --> 01:07:06,320
And I mean, there is, there is
also like a very, let's just say

1143
01:07:06,360 --> 01:07:10,560
like white Country Club vibe to
the whole tower thing.

1144
01:07:10,560 --> 01:07:14,040
Like the, the only person of
colour we really see is like

1145
01:07:14,040 --> 01:07:18,920
Kaufman's manservant and also
like the uniforms they got

1146
01:07:18,920 --> 01:07:22,080
people wearing in there.
It's like it's it's like very,

1147
01:07:22,080 --> 01:07:24,320
what's the word I'm looking for?
But like, like very kind of like

1148
01:07:24,320 --> 01:07:25,880
private army.
Yeah, sure, man.

1149
01:07:26,240 --> 01:07:29,960
Well, that the manservant like
Brian, you're more of our our

1150
01:07:29,960 --> 01:07:33,680
classic movie guru like that
feels like a very intentional

1151
01:07:33,960 --> 01:07:39,040
nod to the role of like what
most African American men and

1152
01:07:39,040 --> 01:07:40,760
women would have been relegated
to.

1153
01:07:40,760 --> 01:07:44,800
And like the even these where
they would be like the cook, the

1154
01:07:44,800 --> 01:07:46,840
Butler, the main.
Yeah, of.

1155
01:07:47,640 --> 01:07:51,920
Course, at the end when Cholo
comes back, Kaufman is spitting

1156
01:07:51,920 --> 01:07:54,800
off some delightful slurs.
For.

1157
01:07:55,600 --> 01:07:57,080
Latino man.
No.

1158
01:07:58,040 --> 01:08:02,360
But even the name Cholo, like
that in itself is a slur against

1159
01:08:02,360 --> 01:08:04,960
Latino men.
And that is like Skip Romero,

1160
01:08:04,960 --> 01:08:08,240
not very subtle in this movie,
in the kind of world that he's

1161
01:08:08,240 --> 01:08:10,400
creating.
Yeah.

1162
01:08:11,240 --> 01:08:14,480
Yeah, I do think also the
zombies, there's a very

1163
01:08:14,480 --> 01:08:18,880
deliberate choice to make them
all essentially working class

1164
01:08:19,319 --> 01:08:21,479
people.
So Big Daddy, I think we kind of

1165
01:08:21,479 --> 01:08:25,279
skipped over talking about
Eugene Clark as a big Daddy, who

1166
01:08:25,600 --> 01:08:27,479
frankly is.
It might be my favorite

1167
01:08:27,479 --> 01:08:29,960
character in the movie.
Oh yeah, 100%.

1168
01:08:30,000 --> 01:08:31,680
It's the zombies that make this
movie for me.

1169
01:08:31,840 --> 01:08:34,359
Yeah.
And so you've got, you know,

1170
01:08:34,359 --> 01:08:37,680
he's a gas station attendant.
And then you have the other one

1171
01:08:37,680 --> 01:08:39,960
who's the butcher.
And those are sort of the

1172
01:08:39,960 --> 01:08:44,120
prominent zombies are are, you
know, working class people.

1173
01:08:44,120 --> 01:08:46,399
You know, they're they're
they're people who make their

1174
01:08:46,399 --> 01:08:51,279
living go about their lives in
sort of a simple but productive

1175
01:08:51,279 --> 01:08:53,560
way.
And, you know, didn't make a lot

1176
01:08:53,560 --> 01:08:57,120
of money in life, but sort of
salt of the earth kind of

1177
01:08:57,120 --> 01:08:59,319
people.
You kind of get the it's it's

1178
01:08:59,319 --> 01:09:05,319
ironic that that you know, the
people who are in a sense, you

1179
01:09:05,319 --> 01:09:10,080
know, preserving the best of,
you know, society that was are

1180
01:09:10,080 --> 01:09:12,920
all zombies now you know,
they're all they're all dead.

1181
01:09:12,920 --> 01:09:17,359
They're all devouring the next
the portion of society, as it

1182
01:09:17,359 --> 01:09:21,160
were.
Yeah, I mean, when there's when

1183
01:09:21,160 --> 01:09:23,920
we see first see the zombies in
this, they're just, for lack of

1184
01:09:23,920 --> 01:09:25,600
a better term, living their
lives.

1185
01:09:25,600 --> 01:09:27,319
You know, they're just going
about their day.

1186
01:09:27,319 --> 01:09:30,640
They're just, you know, the
marching band just Tooting their

1187
01:09:30,640 --> 01:09:33,200
little instruments and things.
They're just they're just going

1188
01:09:33,200 --> 01:09:35,479
about the day.
And then and then the Raiders on

1189
01:09:35,479 --> 01:09:39,479
behalf of Kauffman and the
people in the tower, just like

1190
01:09:39,760 --> 01:09:43,800
Blaze in and, you know, mess
them up for the sake of getting

1191
01:09:43,800 --> 01:09:46,439
some supplies.
But also like that is where we

1192
01:09:46,439 --> 01:09:49,279
that first scene is also where
we see the that this is more of

1193
01:09:49,279 --> 01:09:52,720
a development of the zombies
intelligence as as big Daddy's

1194
01:09:52,720 --> 01:09:56,880
able to kind of like ignore the
fireworks or sky flowers and

1195
01:09:56,920 --> 01:10:00,600
he's just he's filled with rage.
You know, we see him kind of

1196
01:10:00,600 --> 01:10:04,640
like pushing other zombies out
of the way of like the bullets

1197
01:10:04,640 --> 01:10:07,360
and things like it's really,
it's really interesting to say.

1198
01:10:07,360 --> 01:10:12,000
For me, the 1st 15 minutes of
this are maybe the best in the

1199
01:10:12,000 --> 01:10:14,480
movie.
And I think they're, it's a

1200
01:10:14,480 --> 01:10:19,520
really, really solid opening and
you just kind of jump right in

1201
01:10:19,520 --> 01:10:23,800
and you really do see this as a
land of the dead where outside

1202
01:10:23,800 --> 01:10:27,080
out there they're like you said,
they're just kind of existing

1203
01:10:27,480 --> 01:10:29,640
more or less.
You know, yes, they're undead,

1204
01:10:29,640 --> 01:10:33,320
but they are I guess living
their lives as it were.

1205
01:10:33,320 --> 01:10:41,400
And, and this foreign agent that
wants to just stir up trouble is

1206
01:10:41,480 --> 01:10:45,440
disturbing this world.
And they are the ones that kind

1207
01:10:45,440 --> 01:10:50,240
of get, I don't know, they're
the ones that get the bad end of

1208
01:10:50,240 --> 01:10:54,640
that deal, it seems to me.
It is a very natural progression

1209
01:10:54,640 --> 01:10:58,280
of what we saw with like the
first 3 movies and that you have

1210
01:10:58,280 --> 01:11:02,440
like with a night, the initial
outbreak with Don, like what

1211
01:11:02,440 --> 01:11:06,160
happens a few weeks later and
how we thought it was contained

1212
01:11:06,160 --> 01:11:09,320
but actually it has spread.
And then with Day of the Dead,

1213
01:11:09,320 --> 01:11:13,600
how you know, as Doctor
Frankenstein says in that we

1214
01:11:13,800 --> 01:11:19,520
have 400,000 undead for everyone
living, remaining human.

1215
01:11:20,000 --> 01:11:25,160
And what you have in this movie
is whatever is left of humanity

1216
01:11:25,760 --> 01:11:30,040
contained in this like 1 not
even whole city, but a few

1217
01:11:30,040 --> 01:11:35,360
blocks of a city trying to live
out their days where the

1218
01:11:35,360 --> 01:11:39,160
stenchers or the zombies, they
have taken over every other

1219
01:11:39,160 --> 01:11:41,120
aspect of the land.
At this point.

1220
01:11:41,360 --> 01:11:44,960
To me, what Romero was kind of
saying in a lot of, because this

1221
01:11:44,960 --> 01:11:48,480
is not a subtle movie, like this
is very much as like, let's eat

1222
01:11:48,480 --> 01:11:51,440
the rich.
Like literally let's eat the

1223
01:11:51,440 --> 01:11:53,520
rich.
The only thing that's missing is

1224
01:11:53,520 --> 01:11:57,600
a guillotine in a scene.
And you know, which I would be

1225
01:11:57,600 --> 01:12:00,200
all for.
And I think what Romero was

1226
01:12:00,200 --> 01:12:03,240
saying is like, if we're going
to rebuild things, if we're

1227
01:12:03,240 --> 01:12:07,760
going to do things a little bit
different, we can't rebuild

1228
01:12:07,760 --> 01:12:10,120
things the exact same way we did
before.

1229
01:12:10,120 --> 01:12:15,200
Like that part of our culture,
that part of our site society,

1230
01:12:15,600 --> 01:12:18,520
it needs to be destroyed.
It needs to be eaten, it needs

1231
01:12:18,520 --> 01:12:20,720
to be consumed.
And that's the only way.

1232
01:12:21,000 --> 01:12:23,560
Like, that is the problem in
each of these movies.

1233
01:12:23,560 --> 01:12:28,000
Like the problem that the humans
invariably run into is they try

1234
01:12:28,000 --> 01:12:30,640
to recreate the comforts of
their old life.

1235
01:12:30,680 --> 01:12:34,120
And you know, you see that in
Dawn with them, like hunkering

1236
01:12:34,120 --> 01:12:37,160
down at the mall.
You see it in Day in that

1237
01:12:37,160 --> 01:12:40,440
they're like, well, we need to
figure out how to tame these

1238
01:12:40,800 --> 01:12:43,800
zombies so we can go back to our
old way of living.

1239
01:12:43,800 --> 01:12:48,120
And you're like, Sir, it is so
far past that point where that's

1240
01:12:48,120 --> 01:12:50,840
going to be anything we're going
to be able to do.

1241
01:12:50,840 --> 01:12:53,120
Like the time for that would
have been years ago.

1242
01:12:53,120 --> 01:12:55,840
In here, it's the same thing.
It's like, well what if we just

1243
01:12:55,840 --> 01:13:00,200
keep the working population fat
and happy and drunk with like

1244
01:13:00,200 --> 01:13:04,720
games and carnivals while we get
to live a cushy existence in.

1245
01:13:05,000 --> 01:13:08,160
There seems to be only like a
few people that are aware of

1246
01:13:08,160 --> 01:13:13,560
that or feel that disparity.
Yeah, comparing this to the

1247
01:13:14,000 --> 01:13:17,240
previous three, one of the
things that I think stands out

1248
01:13:17,240 --> 01:13:20,680
though is it's just a much more
open, expansive world.

1249
01:13:20,680 --> 01:13:23,240
Because all of all of the
previous three, like you've

1250
01:13:23,240 --> 01:13:26,600
said, Mike or Siege movies, the
threat is outside.

1251
01:13:26,600 --> 01:13:29,480
You have a small group of
survivors hunkered inside a

1252
01:13:29,480 --> 01:13:34,800
building, whether it's a small
farmhouse, a big mall or the

1253
01:13:34,800 --> 01:13:36,960
bunker.
It's kind of the same scenario

1254
01:13:37,000 --> 01:13:39,200
here.
They are going out.

1255
01:13:39,200 --> 01:13:43,800
That starts with them not
pulling themselves in, but going

1256
01:13:43,800 --> 01:13:48,000
out into this world.
And I think that really is

1257
01:13:48,000 --> 01:13:51,240
exciting and it's an exciting
way to start it.

1258
01:13:51,680 --> 01:13:55,000
And then I think for me, the
middle section has its ups and

1259
01:13:55,000 --> 01:13:56,840
downs.
I love the zombie stuff in the

1260
01:13:56,840 --> 01:13:59,240
middle section.
Every time they come back to big

1261
01:13:59,240 --> 01:14:03,880
Daddy and his little group that
he's forming that keeps moving

1262
01:14:03,880 --> 01:14:06,040
closer and closer to Fiddler's
Green.

1263
01:14:06,040 --> 01:14:09,080
I I'm always in on that.
And then, you know, some of the

1264
01:14:09,080 --> 01:14:12,440
things are kind of little.
You know, things are kind of

1265
01:14:12,440 --> 01:14:16,040
interesting along the way, but
you know, the the sort of

1266
01:14:16,040 --> 01:14:19,320
inciting incident.
Hey, I need, you know, he stole

1267
01:14:19,320 --> 01:14:21,520
dead reckoning.
I need you to go after it and

1268
01:14:21,520 --> 01:14:24,240
get it back.
I mean, it's, that's pretty

1269
01:14:24,240 --> 01:14:27,640
typical fair as far as
storytelling goes.

1270
01:14:27,640 --> 01:14:29,760
I mean, it's not particularly
it's.

1271
01:14:29,840 --> 01:14:32,200
Pretty whatever, you don't
really care about that it's.

1272
01:14:32,240 --> 01:14:35,760
Kind of a Western in that sense.
You know, it's that's very much

1273
01:14:35,760 --> 01:14:39,520
of A Western classic Western
sensibility, which is cool too.

1274
01:14:39,560 --> 01:14:43,680
I mean, but you know, it's not
it's not particularly

1275
01:14:43,680 --> 01:14:46,360
innovative.
Whereas I think that horde of

1276
01:14:46,360 --> 01:14:52,600
the zombies realizing that they
actually, when they're together,

1277
01:14:52,920 --> 01:14:57,160
they have more power than the
rich people, this limited number

1278
01:14:57,160 --> 01:15:01,080
of people inside this building
and they can overtake them if

1279
01:15:01,080 --> 01:15:03,520
they band together.
And I think that is really

1280
01:15:03,520 --> 01:15:06,480
fascinating.
And so for me, the 1st 15

1281
01:15:06,480 --> 01:15:10,640
minutes and like the last 20 or
30 minutes is where this movie

1282
01:15:10,640 --> 01:15:12,720
really sings.
And then in the middle, it's

1283
01:15:12,720 --> 01:15:15,280
sort of, it's got its ups and.
Downs we got to get there yeah,

1284
01:15:15,280 --> 01:15:18,880
we need to like get something.
We need an inciting incident

1285
01:15:18,880 --> 01:15:22,560
that will set up the world and
then we need a big climax so

1286
01:15:22,560 --> 01:15:27,160
like that second section is just
kind of exists to push things

1287
01:15:27,160 --> 01:15:29,760
along.
I think if there's like,

1288
01:15:29,760 --> 01:15:33,600
because, you know, unlike, say,
the Star Wars prequels, like

1289
01:15:33,880 --> 01:15:35,760
some people have come around on
those now.

1290
01:15:35,760 --> 01:15:38,640
And I think for like the
millennial generation, like,

1291
01:15:38,640 --> 01:15:42,360
even like, those are the movies
they might even enjoy more than

1292
01:15:42,360 --> 01:15:45,080
the original trilogy because it
feels like that's their Star

1293
01:15:45,080 --> 01:15:46,640
Wars.
And yeah, which?

1294
01:15:46,640 --> 01:15:49,520
I nod my head.
At but understand that at all

1295
01:15:49,520 --> 01:15:50,200
but.
Whatever.

1296
01:15:50,200 --> 01:15:53,640
Like it's like because you think
they saw it at a certain time.

1297
01:15:54,000 --> 01:15:58,200
I don't know anybody that would
say, yeah, the second Living

1298
01:15:58,200 --> 01:16:01,320
Dead trilogy from Romero.
Like, I actually prefer that

1299
01:16:01,320 --> 01:16:05,240
over the original 3.
Like that is a person that, you

1300
01:16:05,240 --> 01:16:08,280
know, you would probably kick
God of normal society at that

1301
01:16:08,280 --> 01:16:12,200
point for their views and that
you would publicly shame them

1302
01:16:12,480 --> 01:16:14,840
for them.
And I think maybe the reason why

1303
01:16:14,840 --> 01:16:20,680
is there aren't really any
compelling human characters in

1304
01:16:20,680 --> 01:16:23,040
these, in any of the three
movies.

1305
01:16:23,040 --> 01:16:26,560
Like we're going to talk about
Diary next week.

1306
01:16:26,560 --> 01:16:30,840
And it is just the most, there's
no one in that.

1307
01:16:30,840 --> 01:16:33,720
Like you're just like everybody
get eaten in the 1st 5 minutes,

1308
01:16:33,720 --> 01:16:36,080
please.
Just I don't want to watch any

1309
01:16:36,080 --> 01:16:40,040
more of this.
And here, like, I mean, Luisiamo

1310
01:16:40,040 --> 01:16:42,760
is great, but like Cholo is a
character.

1311
01:16:42,760 --> 01:16:46,120
Is it necessarily a character?
Yeah.

1312
01:16:46,280 --> 01:16:51,600
And he's not so over the top
like Joe Pilato in Day of the

1313
01:16:51,600 --> 01:16:54,840
Dead where it's such a memorable
performance, you're drawn to it.

1314
01:16:55,120 --> 01:16:57,880
So there's no like Ben, like
there is a Night of the Living

1315
01:16:57,880 --> 01:17:01,920
Dead by with Dwayne Jones.
There's no Peter and Raj and

1316
01:17:02,000 --> 01:17:05,040
Fran.
There's no Sarah or John or

1317
01:17:05,040 --> 01:17:09,000
Billy like there is in Day.
It's just like, you know, to

1318
01:17:09,000 --> 01:17:11,440
your point, Brian, it's just a
bunch of grunts.

1319
01:17:11,960 --> 01:17:15,480
Yeah, yeah.
And I think, you know, I think

1320
01:17:15,480 --> 01:17:18,800
for me, like Rosano stands out
because he's just kind of got an

1321
01:17:18,800 --> 01:17:22,720
IT factor that mostly other
actors don't have and it.

1322
01:17:22,720 --> 01:17:25,400
Yeah.
So I find the lead character in

1323
01:17:25,400 --> 01:17:29,920
this just kind of bland.
And I just like I, I'm not super

1324
01:17:29,920 --> 01:17:33,840
engaged with that and I.
I said Dylan Baker, it's Simon

1325
01:17:33,840 --> 01:17:36,120
Baker, that's how.
OK, sure.

1326
01:17:36,200 --> 01:17:37,560
I mean, that's how I feel about
him.

1327
01:17:37,960 --> 01:17:41,320
He's just like, he's just like I
don't I didn't even bother to

1328
01:17:41,320 --> 01:17:43,880
look up his name.
So you got farther than I did,

1329
01:17:44,240 --> 01:17:47,600
but I was just like I that's how
I felt about him.

1330
01:17:47,600 --> 01:17:51,200
Is like the character is not
written poorly, but I think it's

1331
01:17:51,200 --> 01:17:55,920
just not given the oomph, you
know, if you had because I know

1332
01:17:55,920 --> 01:17:59,720
originally Romero wanted to have
an African American actor in

1333
01:17:59,720 --> 01:18:02,600
this role.
He wanted to have a black actor

1334
01:18:02,600 --> 01:18:08,560
play their lead role here, you
know, just like Ken Forry, just

1335
01:18:08,560 --> 01:18:14,800
like Dwayne Jones and have
someone who could I I think if

1336
01:18:14,800 --> 01:18:20,360
you have, I don't know who who
that would be, but in 2005, but

1337
01:18:21,640 --> 01:18:27,000
someone just with a lot, I think
you get an actor like like

1338
01:18:27,240 --> 01:18:30,320
either of those guys in that
role and you have something that

1339
01:18:30,800 --> 01:18:33,440
is, you know, it doesn't have to
be a black actor either.

1340
01:18:33,440 --> 01:18:37,600
But I mean, just someone who
really has that kind of

1341
01:18:37,600 --> 01:18:40,080
charisma.
I think you could really have it

1342
01:18:40,080 --> 01:18:43,280
would elevate the whole middle
section of this movie so much

1343
01:18:43,280 --> 01:18:46,200
more.
But but, you know, so the studio

1344
01:18:46,200 --> 01:18:49,360
basically told him, no, you need
to have a white actor in the in

1345
01:18:49,360 --> 01:18:52,040
that role.
And then and so he made the the

1346
01:18:52,040 --> 01:18:55,040
lead zombie a black actor, which
you know, and he's great.

1347
01:18:55,040 --> 01:18:56,200
I love it.
Yeah, it's.

1348
01:18:56,560 --> 01:18:58,800
Great, that's.
The thing it's like because the

1349
01:18:58,800 --> 01:19:01,040
humans are just so blind, it
just means that we root for the

1350
01:19:01,040 --> 01:19:02,120
zombies.
Exactly.

1351
01:19:02,560 --> 01:19:05,240
Which I don't think is
necessarily bad because we're at

1352
01:19:05,240 --> 01:19:09,360
this point, I think we're the
zombies actually have taken the

1353
01:19:09,360 --> 01:19:11,760
role.
You know, as often happens in

1354
01:19:11,760 --> 01:19:17,040
series over time, where the the
the big bad of the previous

1355
01:19:17,040 --> 01:19:19,240
movie kind of becomes a hero
over time.

1356
01:19:19,480 --> 01:19:24,040
You start rooting for Jason, you
know, after a few movies, right.

1357
01:19:24,360 --> 01:19:26,200
Yeah.
And I think that's kind of it's

1358
01:19:26,240 --> 01:19:30,960
almost feels like the point of
this one, like you, you, the the

1359
01:19:30,960 --> 01:19:36,320
zombies are maybe on the right
track here as far as the where

1360
01:19:36,320 --> 01:19:39,840
things should be heading.
Yeah, they eat people, but.

1361
01:19:41,160 --> 01:19:45,560
There's a line in 28 Days Later
that one of the soldiers says

1362
01:19:45,840 --> 01:19:48,720
when, like one of the, I think
when it's Christopher Eccleson's

1363
01:19:48,720 --> 01:19:52,360
character talks about things
returning back to the normal.

1364
01:19:52,600 --> 01:19:56,040
There's like the one soldier
who's like, well, the world is

1365
01:19:56,040 --> 01:19:59,240
like a billion years old and
we've only been on it, no.

1366
01:20:00,200 --> 01:20:04,000
10,000 years is meant, right?
So he's like we're kind of a

1367
01:20:04,000 --> 01:20:06,000
blip.
So if humanity gets

1368
01:20:06,000 --> 01:20:09,720
extinguished, that actually
would be the norm.

1369
01:20:09,720 --> 01:20:11,960
Not, you know, man continuing
on.

1370
01:20:11,960 --> 01:20:17,080
And I kind of think of that with
this movie here in that humanity

1371
01:20:17,080 --> 01:20:21,880
has in some ways evolved in that
like this is what it's going to

1372
01:20:21,880 --> 01:20:25,360
be now that the zombies can
think and they do.

1373
01:20:25,680 --> 01:20:29,960
It's more even more than like we
saw this a bit with Bob in Day

1374
01:20:29,960 --> 01:20:32,720
of the Dead, and you see it in
Daughter of the Dead with people

1375
01:20:32,720 --> 01:20:36,440
just returning out of instinct.
And even in Night of the Living

1376
01:20:36,440 --> 01:20:40,280
Dead, the zombies start using
like rudimentary tools, like

1377
01:20:40,720 --> 01:20:43,360
they pick up rocks in order to
smash glass.

1378
01:20:43,360 --> 01:20:46,600
But here when they get to
Fiddler's Green and you have

1379
01:20:46,600 --> 01:20:50,200
that really thick, thick glass
that they would not be able to

1380
01:20:50,200 --> 01:20:53,800
breakthrough just through
physical force, that they use

1381
01:20:53,800 --> 01:20:57,480
the tools they picked up on the
way to smash the glass.

1382
01:20:57,480 --> 01:21:04,320
That when Big Daddy corners
Dennis Hopper Kaufman at the end

1383
01:21:04,320 --> 01:21:09,720
of the movie and he picks up the
gas, the gas nozzle, you think,

1384
01:21:09,760 --> 01:21:13,520
oh, he's going to like fill up
the car gas tank like he would

1385
01:21:13,520 --> 01:21:16,560
and his And he's like, Nope.
He's like, I know what gasoline

1386
01:21:16,560 --> 01:21:19,240
does.
It burns, it ignites.

1387
01:21:19,440 --> 01:21:22,200
So he sticks it through the
window and he covers the whole

1388
01:21:22,200 --> 01:21:26,840
car in gas and then sets it on
fire, which is really brilliant.

1389
01:21:26,840 --> 01:21:30,320
So you can see how they're
they're thinking like they have

1390
01:21:30,320 --> 01:21:32,720
evolved.
The the bit I like is when

1391
01:21:32,800 --> 01:21:35,200
they've kind of they get to a
barricade and he essentially

1392
01:21:35,200 --> 01:21:38,800
kind of directs the Butcher
zombie to use his hatchet.

1393
01:21:38,840 --> 01:21:41,200
Yeah.
Barricade and things like that.

1394
01:21:41,400 --> 01:21:45,800
Or when with the baseball girl,
he kind of like she goes to hit

1395
01:21:45,800 --> 01:21:48,640
someone with her bat and he's
like, no, no, this is how you

1396
01:21:48,640 --> 01:21:50,000
can shoot people.
Yeah.

1397
01:21:51,440 --> 01:21:54,680
Yeah, I I like that a lot.
I think the evolution of the

1398
01:21:54,680 --> 01:21:58,520
zombie is really one of the
great things about this movie,

1399
01:21:58,520 --> 01:22:01,680
and I think it was probably one
of the bigger criticisms of this

1400
01:22:01,680 --> 01:22:05,960
movie from certain corners of
the horror fandom.

1401
01:22:05,960 --> 01:22:09,120
I imagine because I can, I can
just hear them go to, but

1402
01:22:09,120 --> 01:22:11,880
zombies can't do that.
It's like George Romero

1403
01:22:11,880 --> 01:22:15,920
literally created them.
He can have them do whatever he

1404
01:22:15,920 --> 01:22:18,640
wants, you know to.
Tap dance.

1405
01:22:18,680 --> 01:22:20,200
They will tap dance.
Yeah.

1406
01:22:20,440 --> 01:22:24,400
And so I was, I was on board
with this on this viewing with

1407
01:22:24,400 --> 01:22:28,520
the with that.
And I liked it with Bub.

1408
01:22:28,920 --> 01:22:31,720
I remember thinking that was
really cool when I first saw

1409
01:22:31,720 --> 01:22:34,960
Dawn of the Dead or Day of the
Dead way back when, really

1410
01:22:34,960 --> 01:22:40,680
liking the Bub element and also
really liking the continuation

1411
01:22:40,680 --> 01:22:43,800
of that when I first saw this
one years ago as well.

1412
01:22:43,880 --> 01:22:47,640
And it only it reinforced it on
this viewing how kind of well

1413
01:22:47,640 --> 01:22:50,000
done it is.
It's not, it doesn't feel, it

1414
01:22:50,000 --> 01:22:52,080
doesn't feel forced.
It's like this has been a long

1415
01:22:52,080 --> 01:22:57,200
time coming and this like this
this thing that brought them

1416
01:22:57,200 --> 01:23:00,960
back and took over most of their
brains and doesn't require

1417
01:23:00,960 --> 01:23:04,600
function for most of it is sort
of receding in a way.

1418
01:23:04,600 --> 01:23:07,680
Yes, it's still keeping them
going, but the they're higher

1419
01:23:07,680 --> 01:23:13,000
functions are sort of regaining
slowly control over over this

1420
01:23:13,000 --> 01:23:14,640
tissue.
You know, it's pretty.

1421
01:23:14,640 --> 01:23:16,720
Proves Frankenstein right.
Yeah.

1422
01:23:17,400 --> 01:23:21,560
Eventually, like it took maybe
many years afterwards, but he

1423
01:23:21,560 --> 01:23:24,840
was correct.
And then, of course, the very

1424
01:23:24,840 --> 01:23:29,560
iconic shot of this film is when
they basically figure out that

1425
01:23:29,560 --> 01:23:31,680
they can just go through the
water.

1426
01:23:31,680 --> 01:23:34,760
And then, yeah, they're all kind
of like the heads coming up out.

1427
01:23:34,760 --> 01:23:37,400
And I love that shot.
And it's a great shot, yeah.

1428
01:23:38,200 --> 01:23:39,880
Beautiful.
What other?

1429
01:23:39,920 --> 01:23:44,480
Horrifying.
Zombie movies used that.

1430
01:23:44,480 --> 01:23:48,160
I feel like there's one where
like there's a zombie in a shark

1431
01:23:48,200 --> 01:23:50,600
that fight and I can't think of.
That's what.

1432
01:23:50,600 --> 01:23:52,320
That is but.
That's full cheese.

1433
01:23:52,320 --> 01:23:54,080
I feel like that's a.
Yeah, that's full.

1434
01:23:54,280 --> 01:23:56,520
Cheese film.
The zombies do the same thing.

1435
01:23:56,640 --> 01:24:00,360
Yeah, that's full cheese zombie.
He the zombie.

1436
01:24:00,800 --> 01:24:06,000
It was like, OK, let's exploit
Jaws and Dawn of the Dead in the

1437
01:24:06,000 --> 01:24:08,720
same movie.
So the zombie fights a shark and

1438
01:24:08,720 --> 01:24:11,720
like literally bites it.
So yeah.

1439
01:24:11,720 --> 01:24:15,240
So zombie or Zombie 2, depending
on how you want to call it,

1440
01:24:15,240 --> 01:24:17,840
Yeah, so.
The other thing that stands out

1441
01:24:17,840 --> 01:24:23,640
is just like the nonchalance of
even the soldiers in this movie,

1442
01:24:23,920 --> 01:24:28,840
in that like the zombies are
such a part of life that you see

1443
01:24:28,840 --> 01:24:31,920
them everybody getting careless.
I mean, you see that with

1444
01:24:31,920 --> 01:24:36,640
Cholo's character in that like
he causes the death of one of

1445
01:24:36,640 --> 01:24:39,120
his teammates.
Like when he knocks over the

1446
01:24:39,120 --> 01:24:43,160
cigars and he tells the guy to
pick them up and the kid like

1447
01:24:43,160 --> 01:24:44,920
doesn't even tend to look
around.

1448
01:24:44,920 --> 01:24:49,440
He just reaches down and then he
gets gotten that you see in the,

1449
01:24:49,560 --> 01:24:52,640
you know, like at this point the
zombies are being used as a form

1450
01:24:52,640 --> 01:24:56,000
of entertainment.
Like where come and get your

1451
01:24:56,000 --> 01:24:59,440
picture taken with them.
And that just seems like a very

1452
01:24:59,440 --> 01:25:02,760
bad idea where so many things
could go wrong.

1453
01:25:02,760 --> 01:25:06,200
And I don't even want to know
what the insurance liability

1454
01:25:06,440 --> 01:25:10,360
would be on something like that
if something bad were to happen.

1455
01:25:10,720 --> 01:25:14,080
And yet here we are.
And you know, it's a little kind

1456
01:25:14,080 --> 01:25:18,360
of a nod and a that to me.
And like the fireworks, which I

1457
01:25:18,360 --> 01:25:20,680
don't, it's a bit overwritten at
times.

1458
01:25:20,680 --> 01:25:22,880
Like let's call them sky
flowers.

1459
01:25:22,880 --> 01:25:25,760
It's like.
We wouldn't have forgotten what

1460
01:25:25,760 --> 01:25:28,600
they're actually called, yeah.
Yeah, like, no, like they even

1461
01:25:28,600 --> 01:25:33,440
say fireworks at one point and
like the whole like sky flowers

1462
01:25:33,440 --> 01:25:36,520
and it's like, no, they're just
fireworks.

1463
01:25:36,960 --> 01:25:41,760
But this idea that like we can
distract the masses, I think

1464
01:25:41,760 --> 01:25:46,680
even the phrase that was used in
O4 when we went into Iraq was

1465
01:25:46,680 --> 01:25:49,800
like, we're going to use shock
and awe that we're going to have

1466
01:25:50,120 --> 01:25:56,160
these displays of like violence
and carnage and destruction.

1467
01:25:56,480 --> 01:25:59,960
They're going to be so
overwhelming that the average

1468
01:25:59,960 --> 01:26:03,840
person is going to be like
approve of them in a lot of

1469
01:26:03,840 --> 01:26:05,480
ways.
Like, well, isn't it cool that

1470
01:26:05,480 --> 01:26:07,320
we have missiles that can do
that?

1471
01:26:07,720 --> 01:26:10,600
Not thinking like, well, at the
other end of that missile are

1472
01:26:10,600 --> 01:26:14,200
like a number of human beings
that are being blown to pieces.

1473
01:26:14,200 --> 01:26:18,680
And we can use like these sky
flowers and we can use these

1474
01:26:18,680 --> 01:26:22,000
cage games where like we'll
throw people in to get zombies

1475
01:26:22,000 --> 01:26:24,280
to fight one another to see who
gets to eat them.

1476
01:26:24,640 --> 01:26:28,480
Then we can have this carnival
atmosphere almost as a destroy

1477
01:26:28,480 --> 01:26:31,640
it it not almost.
It's a distraction so that the

1478
01:26:31,640 --> 01:26:36,280
masses that greatly outnumber
the rich never even think to

1479
01:26:36,280 --> 01:26:41,000
uprise, aside from like a very
small band of people that know

1480
01:26:41,240 --> 01:26:44,360
we don't have the numbers where
we can have any sort of impact.

1481
01:26:45,000 --> 01:26:47,560
It's very Roman Empire, you
know, give them bread and

1482
01:26:47,560 --> 01:26:51,440
circuses.
And I mean, I'm pretty sure in

1483
01:26:51,440 --> 01:26:55,440
that kind of like carnival area,
I'm pretty sure you do see some

1484
01:26:55,440 --> 01:26:57,840
of the a few of the richer
people in there as well.

1485
01:26:58,080 --> 01:26:59,840
So.
Clearly they like to like come

1486
01:26:59,840 --> 01:27:02,680
down and get their kicks among
the rabbles.

1487
01:27:02,680 --> 01:27:04,040
Slum it.
Yeah.

1488
01:27:04,240 --> 01:27:09,320
Slum it before heading back to
the safety and security of the

1489
01:27:09,320 --> 01:27:14,000
tower.
No, there's even the shot of

1490
01:27:14,000 --> 01:27:17,440
like the bird in the cage and
then later on you come back to

1491
01:27:17,440 --> 01:27:20,120
it and you see that's not even a
real bird, that it's a

1492
01:27:20,240 --> 01:27:23,440
mechanical bird.
On a character note, there is

1493
01:27:23,440 --> 01:27:27,240
like this Allen Van Spring,
because this film feels like it

1494
01:27:27,240 --> 01:27:30,440
ends the series.
Like what you have after this

1495
01:27:30,440 --> 01:27:35,240
with Diary of the Dead is like a
soft reboot of everything that

1496
01:27:35,240 --> 01:27:38,200
had gone on.
So it doesn't really feel in

1497
01:27:38,200 --> 01:27:41,160
place with Night of the Living
Dead and Day, Dawn and Land.

1498
01:27:41,160 --> 01:27:45,200
It feels like it's own thing and
then survival is a direct

1499
01:27:45,200 --> 01:27:49,120
continuation of that.
But there is like a person like

1500
01:27:49,120 --> 01:27:54,160
Alex Van Spring, he turns up, is
one of like the army men

1501
01:27:54,160 --> 01:27:57,720
guarding the city where he's in
charge of dead reckoning when

1502
01:27:57,720 --> 01:28:01,200
it's docked.
And then, like, that actor turns

1503
01:28:01,200 --> 01:28:05,600
up again in Diary of the Dead
very briefly, as like a group of

1504
01:28:05,600 --> 01:28:08,800
soldiers that board the van that
the kids are on.

1505
01:28:09,280 --> 01:28:12,640
And then he becomes the main
character in Survival of the

1506
01:28:12,640 --> 01:28:14,840
Dead.
And I'm almost wondering if this

1507
01:28:14,840 --> 01:28:19,440
is like a trilogy told in a sort
of reverse, that in the end,

1508
01:28:19,440 --> 01:28:22,880
like everything happened in
Diary in Survival and it

1509
01:28:22,880 --> 01:28:26,400
culminates in Land of the Dead
rather than it being a

1510
01:28:26,840 --> 01:28:28,640
continuation of the other
movies.

1511
01:28:28,640 --> 01:28:30,640
And I'm not sure where I land on
that.

1512
01:28:30,880 --> 01:28:35,000
Or it was just like happy
happenstance that I hired this

1513
01:28:35,000 --> 01:28:38,920
guy for one scene for two movies
and then made him the lead.

1514
01:28:39,680 --> 01:28:43,640
I haven't seen Diary or survival
recent enough to be able to

1515
01:28:43,640 --> 01:28:46,160
comment.
You're not missing a lot.

1516
01:28:46,440 --> 01:28:50,800
Yeah, I did pick up a cheap
Blu-ray of Survival of the Dead

1517
01:28:50,800 --> 01:28:53,240
though, so maybe we can I can at
least watch that one.

1518
01:28:54,000 --> 01:28:56,920
I am surprised those are not
preciously held.

1519
01:28:57,280 --> 01:29:01,840
I own 2 copies of Survival of
the Dead and I have no idea how

1520
01:29:01,840 --> 01:29:05,040
I'm like that.
Feels like 2 too many but here

1521
01:29:05,040 --> 01:29:07,840
we are.
Yeah, I think the real answer is

1522
01:29:07,840 --> 01:29:13,160
just random happenstance, but I,
I mean, I, I think as far as

1523
01:29:13,160 --> 01:29:15,920
kind of like little movie
theories go, I've heard worse

1524
01:29:16,400 --> 01:29:19,160
like.
Well, what's the worst one?

1525
01:29:19,240 --> 01:29:21,280
I kid, I kid.
What else do we?

1526
01:29:21,800 --> 01:29:24,200
Well, it's like, well, you know,
like all of those words like,

1527
01:29:24,240 --> 01:29:27,320
you know, some sort of like kids
film and it's like a a theory

1528
01:29:27,320 --> 01:29:29,640
about it that makes it like
really, really dark or

1529
01:29:29,640 --> 01:29:33,640
something, you know, like some,
some like like they'd.

1530
01:29:33,840 --> 01:29:37,480
Like people like.
Well, but no, like like sort of

1531
01:29:37,480 --> 01:29:40,560
like kids movies where they're
like, it's clearly like the main

1532
01:29:40,560 --> 01:29:45,640
character is is dying and this
is like his dying fantasy, OK,

1533
01:29:45,720 --> 01:29:48,200
kind of like that kind of thing.
Like, like people like to do

1534
01:29:48,200 --> 01:29:50,560
that a lot with like really
awesome movies.

1535
01:29:50,880 --> 01:29:54,600
Yeah, see, my thing is and I
love Home Alone and Home Alone

1536
01:29:54,600 --> 01:29:56,440
2.
I think those are so much fun.

1537
01:29:56,800 --> 01:30:00,680
And Home Alone 2 is Home Alone 2
is a horror movie.

1538
01:30:01,040 --> 01:30:04,640
I mean, to me, Home Alone and
Home Alone 2, like, those are

1539
01:30:04,680 --> 01:30:11,280
like, like Kevin McAllister grew
up to be Jigsaw is my thing is

1540
01:30:11,280 --> 01:30:16,360
like, that is because you see it
in a Home Alone too, where he

1541
01:30:16,360 --> 01:30:19,400
doesn't really need to torture
the Wet Bandits like in the

1542
01:30:19,400 --> 01:30:22,480
first movie.
Yeah, he has to defend the home

1543
01:30:22,760 --> 01:30:25,600
so you can see where it goes
awry.

1544
01:30:26,040 --> 01:30:29,040
But in Home Alone too, like he's
in New York City, one of the

1545
01:30:29,040 --> 01:30:32,600
biggest cities in the world,
where there's a cop on every

1546
01:30:32,680 --> 01:30:35,000
corner.
And any point he could have

1547
01:30:35,000 --> 01:30:38,840
gotten to someone that would
help him and not have to tort.

1548
01:30:38,840 --> 01:30:42,520
He just wanted to hurt people.
He just wanted to hurt the Wet

1549
01:30:42,520 --> 01:30:44,360
Bandits.
And he gets off on it.

1550
01:30:44,680 --> 01:30:48,200
So it's, to me, that's a dark,
dark theory.

1551
01:30:48,200 --> 01:30:51,800
But well, Nicotero comes back.
I just want to mention K&B

1552
01:30:52,080 --> 01:30:56,640
briefly because I do feel that
there are some of, like, the

1553
01:30:56,640 --> 01:30:59,800
best zombie effects in a film
here.

1554
01:31:00,120 --> 01:31:02,440
And then there's also some of
the.

1555
01:31:02,960 --> 01:31:06,080
And this is a trend that will
continue in the next two movies.

1556
01:31:06,400 --> 01:31:11,600
You see Romero employing CGI for
the first time, and it never

1557
01:31:11,600 --> 01:31:14,040
gets any better whenever he uses
it.

1558
01:31:14,120 --> 01:31:16,480
Yeah.
It's like, I mean, I like the

1559
01:31:16,480 --> 01:31:19,560
concept of like when you turn
around and there seems to be

1560
01:31:19,560 --> 01:31:23,440
like a headless zombie and then
it like flips its head over to

1561
01:31:23,440 --> 01:31:25,400
bite.
I love the concept of that.

1562
01:31:25,400 --> 01:31:32,200
The execution less so and I
think as a like a brand and I

1563
01:31:32,200 --> 01:31:34,320
think after the zombies
breakdown the barricade, they'd

1564
01:31:34,320 --> 01:31:37,000
like see a bunch of zombies that
have been caught in snare traps

1565
01:31:37,000 --> 01:31:40,600
or something and like just the
CGI face just like pops into

1566
01:31:40,600 --> 01:31:43,360
view and it's like, oh, oh,
that, that does look good.

1567
01:31:43,960 --> 01:31:46,720
A lot of it is with the blood,
like a lot of it is going to get

1568
01:31:46,720 --> 01:31:49,000
headshot.
You can see that.

1569
01:31:49,200 --> 01:31:52,720
And like, there's one, one
that's really egregious is like

1570
01:31:52,720 --> 01:31:57,440
when Leguizamo's character like,
shoots a zombie in the head when

1571
01:31:57,440 --> 01:32:00,960
it's lying on top of him and you
see like the blood splatter from

1572
01:32:00,960 --> 01:32:04,520
CGI and then you come back to
him and he doesn't have a drop

1573
01:32:04,520 --> 01:32:08,120
of anything on him.
You're like, OK, that doesn't

1574
01:32:08,120 --> 01:32:11,640
seem right.
Yeah, CGI does not do blood

1575
01:32:11,640 --> 01:32:14,920
well, No, it's never.
It still doesn't.

1576
01:32:15,160 --> 01:32:21,880
It still doesn't, no, but it is
good to see that there is, you

1577
01:32:21,880 --> 01:32:27,080
know, quite a lot of practical
effects still going on.

1578
01:32:27,080 --> 01:32:32,280
I know they augment it with with
CGI, of course, which, you know,

1579
01:32:32,280 --> 01:32:37,840
was sort of, you know, that's if
if you're going to do CGI, using

1580
01:32:37,840 --> 01:32:40,640
it as an augmentation is the
best way to do it, I think.

1581
01:32:40,920 --> 01:32:45,640
But yeah, I know Romero was
never really, he didn't ever

1582
01:32:45,640 --> 01:32:52,000
want to do it, but it kind of
became necessary, I think just.

1583
01:32:52,120 --> 01:32:54,120
Well, I think in the next two
movies, yeah.

1584
01:32:54,120 --> 01:32:57,880
Yeah, it's just cost prohibitive
to not have any.

1585
01:32:58,480 --> 01:33:01,520
Yeah, You know, I think he would
say like with survival, it just

1586
01:33:01,520 --> 01:33:05,720
let them keep shooting and then
we can fix it later and it just

1587
01:33:06,040 --> 01:33:08,800
it just he didn't have the
budget to do it.

1588
01:33:08,800 --> 01:33:12,240
Well, like you can do it and you
can get away with it to a

1589
01:33:12,240 --> 01:33:16,000
certain extent, but you go
especially like coming off of

1590
01:33:16,000 --> 01:33:20,160
watching like Day of the Dead
where I think that might be some

1591
01:33:20,160 --> 01:33:24,240
of the best effects work ever in
a horror movie.

1592
01:33:24,240 --> 01:33:29,080
And that's all 100% practical.
You have great make up here.

1593
01:33:29,080 --> 01:33:32,360
Like Brian, like you said, the
1st 15 minutes, you know, I

1594
01:33:32,360 --> 01:33:36,480
think of like the cheerleader
zombie and like that shot of

1595
01:33:36,480 --> 01:33:38,720
her, it's so good.
It's unfor.

1596
01:33:38,720 --> 01:33:43,920
And you do have like 1 scene of
like a the belly button scene is

1597
01:33:43,920 --> 01:33:47,320
so grotesque and just so
disturbing.

1598
01:33:47,640 --> 01:33:50,040
So when you get those scenes,
that's great.

1599
01:33:50,040 --> 01:33:51,680
It's unfortunate that you have
to.

1600
01:33:51,680 --> 01:33:54,480
And the bites look really good
here as well.

1601
01:33:54,480 --> 01:33:57,000
The bites like they keep.
That's one thing that's

1602
01:33:57,000 --> 01:33:59,880
consistent in all of these
movies is when you get bitten.

1603
01:33:59,880 --> 01:34:03,640
It looks great.
Well, I don't have a lot else.

1604
01:34:03,640 --> 01:34:06,240
I mean, do we have anything else
on Land of the Dead?

1605
01:34:06,280 --> 01:34:09,400
Really, I mean, I mean, one of
the saying about like the

1606
01:34:09,400 --> 01:34:13,320
subtlety of the film, there's
the line after bitten where he

1607
01:34:13,320 --> 01:34:18,080
says his buddy offers to shoot
him and he goes, Nah, I think I

1608
01:34:18,080 --> 01:34:19,480
want to see how the other half
live.

1609
01:34:19,480 --> 01:34:23,680
That's definitely a bit on the.
Yeah, it's not a sudden.

1610
01:34:23,680 --> 01:34:28,400
It just speaks to Cholo's
character like, well, it just

1611
01:34:28,400 --> 01:34:34,040
broke up a little bit there.
A bit fuzzy there.

1612
01:34:36,200 --> 01:34:37,680
Yeah.
Do you want to take that from

1613
01:34:37,680 --> 01:34:39,760
the top again?
And I'll just edit the other

1614
01:34:39,760 --> 01:34:42,520
part out.
Yeah, sure.

1615
01:34:44,120 --> 01:34:47,160
Yeah, No, basically like talking
about the extreme lack of

1616
01:34:47,160 --> 01:34:50,560
subtlety in this film.
There's the line that Chow has

1617
01:34:50,560 --> 01:34:55,800
after he gets bitten by a zombie
where he's where his mate offers

1618
01:34:55,800 --> 01:34:58,760
to shoot him and he and he goes.
Now I want to see how the other

1619
01:34:58,760 --> 01:35:00,240
half live it's like.
Yeah.

1620
01:35:01,040 --> 01:35:04,720
Wow, just just really, really
nuance, George.

1621
01:35:04,720 --> 01:35:07,120
Nuance.
Don't know what it is.

1622
01:35:07,400 --> 01:35:10,360
God bless yourself.
Because you could watch the the

1623
01:35:10,360 --> 01:35:15,040
first three, I think, and just
watch them as, you know,

1624
01:35:15,560 --> 01:35:18,600
whatever I think the second one
is, you know, it's a fun romp.

1625
01:35:18,640 --> 01:35:22,200
I never really thought about the
consumerism aspect of it when I

1626
01:35:22,200 --> 01:35:23,680
first saw that when I was
younger.

1627
01:35:24,800 --> 01:35:27,680
I didn't think about, you know,
Vietnam and revolution when I

1628
01:35:27,680 --> 01:35:29,320
was watching Night of the Living
Dead.

1629
01:35:29,320 --> 01:35:32,600
But then or, you know, even
Reaganism and Day of the Dead.

1630
01:35:32,600 --> 01:35:35,920
But you know that it's all there
in those.

1631
01:35:35,920 --> 01:35:38,440
But this one, it's like you
cannot miss.

1632
01:35:38,680 --> 01:35:41,160
Can't miss it.
The social commentary

1633
01:35:41,160 --> 01:35:43,040
especially, I think by this
point it's like.

1634
01:35:43,040 --> 01:35:45,760
Literally eating the rich.
Literally eating them.

1635
01:35:46,280 --> 01:35:51,040
Well, and here by this time,
Romero was very much known as a

1636
01:35:51,040 --> 01:35:55,120
political filmmaker.
He he all of his zombie movies

1637
01:35:55,120 --> 01:36:01,440
have a something in them about,
you know, the social commentary

1638
01:36:01,440 --> 01:36:05,360
was just a key part of his, of
his version of the zombie.

1639
01:36:05,360 --> 01:36:07,840
Yeah.
Yeah, there's a deleted scene

1640
01:36:07,840 --> 01:36:11,480
where Big Daddy is handing out
Che Guerrero shirts before they

1641
01:36:12,000 --> 01:36:15,240
go into the city, but that
didn't make it into the final

1642
01:36:15,240 --> 01:36:18,120
cut.
Like even like Romero's like

1643
01:36:18,120 --> 01:36:25,240
maybe that's a little bit a step
too far, which that would be

1644
01:36:25,240 --> 01:36:29,520
amazing.
Or yeah, some big daddy has a

1645
01:36:29,520 --> 01:36:35,440
Karl Marx tattoo on his neck.
And you just, I mean, well, it's

1646
01:36:35,440 --> 01:36:38,440
almost too it's, it's almost,
it's in a lot of ways for

1647
01:36:38,440 --> 01:36:42,200
Romero's detriment that he did
feel that he had to be that

1648
01:36:42,200 --> 01:36:44,960
person.
So I think that it's almost like

1649
01:36:44,960 --> 01:36:47,360
he constrains himself in his
writing.

1650
01:36:47,640 --> 01:36:50,880
Like there's the theme 1st and
then everything else around it

1651
01:36:50,880 --> 01:36:54,080
where I think that just would
have naturally come out in

1652
01:36:54,080 --> 01:36:58,000
Romero if he were just allowed
himself to just write what was

1653
01:36:58,000 --> 01:37:00,600
on his mind.
And then those themes would have

1654
01:37:00,600 --> 01:37:04,720
made their way into the movie in
a more subtle and nuanced way,

1655
01:37:05,440 --> 01:37:08,320
you know, And you and I think
the especially the next movie

1656
01:37:08,680 --> 01:37:12,240
really suffers for it.
Like the next film really,

1657
01:37:12,240 --> 01:37:16,560
really suffers for the text
being like right at the surface.

1658
01:37:17,000 --> 01:37:19,680
And it's a, to be honest, like
the thing about Diary of the

1659
01:37:19,680 --> 01:37:24,000
Dead, it's probably the most
relevant message in terms of

1660
01:37:24,000 --> 01:37:28,920
like what we're experiencing in
2025 and media manipulation and

1661
01:37:28,920 --> 01:37:32,880
media being used as a source of
entertainment rather than to

1662
01:37:32,880 --> 01:37:36,520
inform.
But it's just such a horror

1663
01:37:36,520 --> 01:37:40,760
movie that it's very hard to
kind of like dig into that.

1664
01:37:40,760 --> 01:37:45,520
So that's our hint for next
week's episode listeners, in

1665
01:37:45,520 --> 01:37:49,720
terms of you might get grumpy
mic when it comes to talking

1666
01:37:49,720 --> 01:37:51,600
about.
Well, that fifth entry syndrome

1667
01:37:51,600 --> 01:37:55,040
I think is, you know, because I
mean, it's the 5th, the 5th

1668
01:37:55,080 --> 01:37:58,600
movie is a lot of time.
It's a real it's the worst of

1669
01:37:58,600 --> 01:38:00,560
the series.
It's a it's a tough go in a lot

1670
01:38:00,560 --> 01:38:02,920
of cases.
Elm Street, Elm Street 5 and.

1671
01:38:03,720 --> 01:38:05,520
Friday 5.
Halloween 5.

1672
01:38:05,520 --> 01:38:08,120
Friday 5.
Though I know it's I know it's

1673
01:38:08,120 --> 01:38:10,320
not a great movie, but I love
Friday 5.

1674
01:38:11,280 --> 01:38:13,560
Well, you are all about topless
women, Brian.

1675
01:38:13,560 --> 01:38:17,720
If there's one thing I know it's
like, I mean, you've said

1676
01:38:17,720 --> 01:38:20,720
before, I like my coffee, like I
like my women naked.

1677
01:38:20,960 --> 01:38:24,320
So it's just just these, I
didn't say it.

1678
01:38:24,320 --> 01:38:26,240
Brian says it all the time.
Just.

1679
01:38:26,320 --> 01:38:28,320
Think about this.
I'm learning so much.

1680
01:38:28,400 --> 01:38:31,480
Psycho Movie is the remake so
hey.

1681
01:38:31,720 --> 01:38:36,920
Oh, trendy no.
It's Scream film is the first

1682
01:38:36,920 --> 01:38:38,600
radio science one that's pretty
decent.

1683
01:38:39,080 --> 01:38:41,720
It's pretty good.
It's yeah.

1684
01:38:41,760 --> 01:38:44,200
It's better than the 6th one.
It's better than the 6th one.

1685
01:38:44,200 --> 01:38:45,640
It's better than the 6th.
No.

1686
01:38:45,640 --> 01:38:48,960
I did like screen 5A lot, so I
can't argue with you there.

1687
01:38:49,320 --> 01:38:52,800
What was child play?
Proves the rule.

1688
01:38:53,440 --> 01:38:57,200
Child's play was the not bride
of Chucky, it was the seed of.

1689
01:38:57,640 --> 01:39:01,640
Chucky.
Seed of Chucky, which it's fun,

1690
01:39:02,000 --> 01:39:03,960
but it's definitely a step down
from bride.

1691
01:39:03,960 --> 01:39:05,440
It's better than three.
It's.

1692
01:39:05,840 --> 01:39:09,360
Pretty.
Yeah, it is better than. 4 is 4

1693
01:39:09,360 --> 01:39:12,200
is like often where like the
hidden gem is like you have

1694
01:39:12,200 --> 01:39:16,000
dream master final chapter
Halloween.

1695
01:39:16,000 --> 01:39:19,880
Like it feels like people have
come around in Halloween 4 and

1696
01:39:19,880 --> 01:39:22,880
that they're like, it's not as
good as Halloween obviously, but

1697
01:39:23,120 --> 01:39:26,080
it's the one that I would throw
on for Halloween season.

1698
01:39:26,400 --> 01:39:29,160
Yeah, because it's.
Just a really fun one.

1699
01:39:29,520 --> 01:39:31,280
Texas Chainsaw.
The next generation.

1700
01:39:31,280 --> 01:39:35,360
I love Texas Chainsaw Four.
I love that Renee Zelliger

1701
01:39:35,360 --> 01:39:37,960
telling Leatherface to sit down
and shut up.

1702
01:39:37,960 --> 01:39:42,560
And he does like I.
And whatever Matthew Kahanahay

1703
01:39:42,560 --> 01:39:46,600
is doing, I've come around on
that movie like that is so much

1704
01:39:46,600 --> 01:39:51,400
fun to watch.
So, all right, listeners, that

1705
01:39:51,400 --> 01:39:54,080
is, that is it.
Sarah, do you have anything you

1706
01:39:54,080 --> 01:39:58,400
want to pitch or promote or let
people know how to find you out

1707
01:39:58,400 --> 01:40:01,760
there in the interwebs?
Or you, like, know you're all a

1708
01:40:01,760 --> 01:40:03,600
bunch of weirdos?
Oh well, that's all right,

1709
01:40:03,600 --> 01:40:07,200
because I we are the weirdos.
Mr. I can mostly be found

1710
01:40:07,200 --> 01:40:12,440
lurking around on Blue sky where
my handle is at Sarah Joe Miles.

1711
01:40:12,440 --> 01:40:17,080
So you can also find me on
Letterbox, which where I'm Sarah

1712
01:40:17,080 --> 01:40:19,920
Joe Smiley and yeah, at the
moment.

1713
01:40:19,920 --> 01:40:24,120
I mean, I've been writing a lot
of anime reviews and things, so

1714
01:40:24,120 --> 01:40:26,320
not as much horror, but
hopefully soon.

1715
01:40:26,600 --> 01:40:28,560
Couple of things got the ball
rolling on.

1716
01:40:29,560 --> 01:40:32,040
Excellent.
How about yourself, Brian?

1717
01:40:33,120 --> 01:40:36,480
Well, you can find me at the
various socials at Brian Waves

1718
01:40:36,480 --> 01:40:37,800
42.
See here.

1719
01:40:37,800 --> 01:40:40,840
I, I feel like I'm repeating
myself a lot, kind of the same

1720
01:40:40,840 --> 01:40:42,480
things.
But my Young Frankenstein

1721
01:40:42,480 --> 01:40:47,040
article is now alive, as they
say, over at Matter

1722
01:40:47,040 --> 01:40:50,160
vellum.medium.com, so you can
check that out.

1723
01:40:50,200 --> 01:40:53,880
There's stuff at Bloody
Disgusting coming out fairly

1724
01:40:53,880 --> 01:40:57,400
often right now because, hey,
I'm on summer vacation, so I got

1725
01:40:57,400 --> 01:40:58,640
a little more time to write
stuff.

1726
01:40:58,640 --> 01:41:02,280
So, yeah, so you can.
That's really where you can find

1727
01:41:02,280 --> 01:41:04,800
my work.
Also, if you're a Mario Bava

1728
01:41:04,800 --> 01:41:08,080
fan, I have a couple of
commentaries on that box set

1729
01:41:08,080 --> 01:41:11,000
that's come out just right
around the time we're recording

1730
01:41:11,000 --> 01:41:14,640
this, so on Black Sunday and
Black Sabbath.

1731
01:41:15,960 --> 01:41:18,920
Well, listeners, you can find me
at Mike's Noonie and on Blue

1732
01:41:18,920 --> 01:41:24,040
Sky, same on Instagram, and
follow me on Letterbox at Mike

1733
01:41:24,040 --> 01:41:26,560
Chump Change.
And you can follow the show at

1734
01:41:26,560 --> 01:41:30,440
Pod and Pendulum both on Blue
Sky and Instagram as well.

1735
01:41:30,440 --> 01:41:34,080
Go to our site, Pod of the
pendulum.com and consider

1736
01:41:34,080 --> 01:41:38,800
becoming a patron at
patreon.com/pod of the Pendulum.

1737
01:41:39,080 --> 01:41:42,600
That is it this week for let's
see if we can cue this

1738
01:41:42,600 --> 01:41:45,000
correctly.
That is it this week for Land of

1739
01:41:45,000 --> 01:41:48,160
the Dead.
Sarah, thank you so much for

1740
01:41:48,360 --> 01:41:50,160
joining us.
You're coming back for Dawn of

1741
01:41:50,160 --> 01:41:54,000
the Dead and you're going to
just talk that shit the whole

1742
01:41:54,000 --> 01:41:56,880
time?
Oh yeah, that's the comments

1743
01:41:56,880 --> 01:41:58,640
section are going to be a
nightmare, sorry.

1744
01:41:58,800 --> 01:42:01,480
Excellent.
Well, that is great listeners.

1745
01:42:01,480 --> 01:42:03,840
Thanks so much.
Have a great week and we'll be

1746
01:42:03,840 --> 01:42:07,480
back next week with Diary of the
Dead.

1747
01:42:07,600 --> 01:42:09,920
It's the summer of Jord lumbers
on.